Star Trek

[Buster's Uncle]

William Shatner responds after Ted Cruz says Captain Kirk was likely a Republican
Entertainment Weekly
by Jessica Derschowitz • @jessicasara • Posted July 26 2015 — 2:37 PM EDT



Star Trek (TV Show - 1966) (Everett Collection)



William Shatner has weighed in on Ted Cruz’s theory about his Star Trek character’s political leanings.

In an interview with The New York Times Magazine, the Republican presidential candidate and Star Trek fan said he prefers Shatner’s Captain Kirk over Patrick Stewart’s Captain Picard.

Cruz called Picard a “complete captain” and added, “If you look at Star Trek: The Next Generation, it basically split James T. Kirk into two people. Picard was Kirk’s rational side, and William Riker was his passionate side.”

“The original Star Trek was grittier,” he said. “Kirk is working class; Picard is an aristocrat. Kirk is a passionate fighter for justice; Picard is a cerebral philosopher.”

When asked where he thinks Kirk stands politically, Cruz replied, “I think it is quite likely that Kirk is a Republican and Picard is a Democrat.”

Shatner responded to Cruz’s comments this week on Twitter, saying that Star Trek “wasn’t political.”

“Star Trek wasn’t political. I’m not political; I can’t even vote in the US,” he wrote. “So to put a geocentric label on interstellar characters is silly.”

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/07/26/william-shatner-ted-cruz-captain-kirk-republican


FWIW, at least Cruz is a Trek fan - he's engaging in wishful thinking, but Shatner's opinion isn't worth as much as that.

Star Trek was incredibly political in the Swiftian mode, but I wouldn't expect either gentleman to know that.

[Mylochka]

I agree -- "Renegades" featured a really good version of Chekov.  Thank goodness.  This production needed a "B plot" that could hold your attention.  The production values were good, but the script was pretty weak.  For example, you'd notice if your crewmate was a hologram, wouldn't you?  Pretty quickly, right?

I kept thinking "If I'd read the book, this might make more sense..."  Except there's no book.

[Mylochka]

Oh, and I luv the new Star Trek theme available at this site!

[Buster's Uncle]

I needed to hear that.

I agree -- "Renegades" featured a really good version of Chekov.  Thank goodness.  This production needed a "B plot" that could hold your attention.  The production values were good, but the script was pretty weak.  For example, you'd notice if your crewmate was a hologram, wouldn't you?  Pretty quickly, right?

I kept thinking "If I'd read the book, this might make more sense..."  Except there's no book.

As I said:

Low expectations going in are definitely helping me enjoy this - I expected to hate every second, so when they get something right, it's a delight.  The acting is bad and it doesn't seem to be about anything interesting, but if you can get past Chekov's relative youth, they're getting him right.  -I only expected a five-minute cameo in the setup, but this is a substantial part.  This is something like the fellow he was supposed to grow up to be, and didn't get to in the movies.  Level-headed and experienced, confident, capable - hasn't been tortured and/or screamed any yet.

-He has a model of the real Enterprise in his office.  None of that &^%$#@! movie crap, either.  The callbacks to real Star Trek would be easy to blow by overdoing, but they're hitting it just right.

Persons inexplicably enamored of the little [censored] have to give this turkey of a movie a watch - remember to go in knowing it sucks and everyone hates it, and you'll enjoy as of halfway through...

I'm not convinced anyone but me has read the whole live review I spent hours on...

[Valka]

Mylochka says that I have an excellent memory for music.  -I have a bunch of scores from old-standard musicals I was in nearly 40 years ago stored in my bean, though, like you say, getting very weak on the lyrics.

Was in a production of JCS in 1987 as a disciple.  I used to be able to do Mary's songs in a very credible soprano, before renfairs ruined my falsetto.  I LOVE THAT SCORE.  (The book doesn't display a great grasp of Jesus, but it's really a story about Lazarus, anyway.)

I think you mean Judas, since Lazarus wasn't even mentioned other than obliquely in a line during the King Herod scene, and not even by name.

True story: One of the guys who was in the chorus was the RL brother of the guy who played Jesus. This guy turned up on my doorstep one year in the '90s, running as a Liberal candidate in the provincial election. I hadn't voted Liberal provincially for years, after how their delegates acted at the leadership convention when they ended up at the same hotel as the science fiction convention I was attending.

So anyway, I recognized him, and reminded him that I'd been on the props crew. We chatted a little about the show - it was an incredible experience for all of us; imagine about 100 people, cast and crew, high on nothing but having a good time putting this play together.

Later on, my dad and I were talking about it and I told him who the Liberal candidate was. So after that, if anyone asked my dad who he was voting for, he'd say the Liberals, because the guy running was the brother of Jesus Christ. (yes, my dad was being facetious )

[Valka]

I'm not convinced anyone but me has read the whole live review I spent hours on...

I know you keep tabs on who's been here and when, but the truth is that just because I've been here, it doesn't mean I've really been able to properly pay attention.

We're in election mode here in Canada, and that's where my mind is, most of the time - trying to get rid of a thoroughly corrupt Prime Minister and government. And while I know which party I want to vote for, it's not the choice that would help accomplish this. If ever there was a "hold your nose and vote strategically" election, it's this one.

[Buster's Uncle]

Okay - when you can clear some time, do try to read and discuss the whole thing, willya?  I didn't do all that to entertain myself, and I'd like to get more conversation-payoff than thus far.

Mylochka says that I have an excellent memory for music.  -I have a bunch of scores from old-standard musicals I was in nearly 40 years ago stored in my bean, though, like you say, getting very weak on the lyrics.

Was in a production of JCS in 1987 as a disciple.  I used to be able to do Mary's songs in a very credible soprano, before renfairs ruined my falsetto.  I LOVE THAT SCORE.  (The book doesn't display a great grasp of Jesus, but it's really a story about Lazarus, anyway.)

I think you mean Judas, since Lazarus wasn't even mentioned other than obliquely in a line during the King Herod scene, and not even by name.

I can't beLIEVE I did that.


JUST don't SAY I'm/TYpoed for ALL time!

[Buster's Uncle]

Ricardo Montalban discusses the film "Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan" - EMMYTVLEGENDS.ORG

Trek considerations aside, we get to listen to Ricardo Montalban talk here.  Living in the future is awesome.  Hit play.

[Mylochka]

[/quote]I'm not convinced anyone but me has read the whole live review I spent hours on...
[/quote]

I just finished watching the movie... and then I ran out of paint... and then there was that Ted Cruz thing... I'm gonna get to it, though!

[Mylochka]

I hate to agree with Ted Cruz on anything, but I could see Kirk as being the 23rd c version of a Republican.  He's got to be pretty strong on defense and military spending, at least... And he does have the reputation of being a bit of a Herbert at times...

Times change and perspectives change with them.  Imagine how liberal today's Republicans would look to the conservatives of Andrew Jackson's days.

But yeah, Shatner's wrong.  Star Trek was pretty overtly political and would have been moreso if the censors would have allowed.

William Shatner responds after Ted Cruz says Captain Kirk was likely a Republican

FWIW, at least Cruz is a Trek fan - he's engaging in wishful thinking, but Shatner's opinion isn't worth as much as that.

Star Trek was incredibly political in the Swiftian mode, but I wouldn't expect either gentleman to know that.

[vonbach]

Star Trek was incredibly political in the Swiftian mode, but I wouldn't expect either gentleman to know that.

It reminds me of Galaxy Quest when the one guy turns to them and says "didn't any of you actually watch the show?"

[Valka]

JUST don't SAY I'm/TYpoed for ALL time!

And I just heard that in my mind in Roy Kanhai's voice. He was a wonderful singer. I learned last year that he died a few years back. Several of the people I knew from that production have died over the years.

[Buster's Uncle]

Catching up after cooking and eating supper.  BRB.  I have reactions when I catch my breath...

[Buster's Uncle]

I hate to agree with Ted Cruz on anything, but I could see Kirk as being the 23rd c version of a Republican.  He's got to be pretty strong on defense and military spending, at least... And he does have the reputation of being a bit of a Herbert at times...

Times change and perspectives change with them.  Imagine how liberal today's Republicans would look to the conservatives of Andrew Jackson's days.

But yeah, Shatner's wrong.  Star Trek was pretty overtly political and would have been moreso if the censors would have allowed.

William Shatner responds after Ted Cruz says Captain Kirk was likely a Republican

FWIW, at least Cruz is a Trek fan - he's engaging in wishful thinking, but Shatner's opinion isn't worth as much as that.

Star Trek was incredibly political in the Swiftian mode, but I wouldn't expect either gentleman to know that.

None of the real Star Trek people were SF fans, let alone Star Trek fans, except Dorothy Fontana, to be fair to Shatner.  Cruz is either an actual fan or had someone who is writing those remarks for him, I'm satisfied. -But I doubt he'd exactly read The Making of Star Trek twice before he turned 10.  You don't hear even really hardcore fandom fans talking about the Jonathan Swift politics-by-secret-allegory aspect much, do you?

If you take the novelization of Star Trek: Der Film as having some level of canonicity because Roddenberry wrote it (I don't, because it was bad, and the smart play is to pick and choose among Rodenberry's often-bad ideas when they didn't slime the screen [we miss you, Gene Coon]) he had it explicit that Kirk and most of Starfleet are thowbacks, because the New Human types who were the majority in that time made very bad officers and crew.

So define Republican for the purposes of this conversation.

He's probably something like one by the standards of his time and place -career military "professional killer" and all- but I don't think he'd fit in with OUR Republicans since they stopped being the liberal party somewhere around 40 years between the two Roosevelts.  He'd probably do real fine giving a speech at the contemporary Libertarian national convention -they'd run 'im for president if they could- but they're sort've a different political spectrum than just left-right.

Star Trek was incredibly political in the Swiftian mode, but I wouldn't expect either gentleman to know that.

It reminds me of Galaxy Quest when the one guy turns to them and says "didn't any of you actually watch the show?"

[shrugs]  A hard-right guy like Cruz would have a tough time knowing and staying a fan - Star Trek was stridently liberal.

[Buster's Uncle]

I haven't gotten to doing but a lick of work today, between catching up on an ST forum I'd stopped patrolling daily two months ago, because busy here, and lively/pleasantly engaging conversation here in th' Commons.


I'm not up to the present yet, but it's increasingly looking like a The Cage photonovel comic adaption from John Byrne is going to happen. -Like the original-story 'photoplay' comics, started as him messing around in photshop to see if he could, because he's a genuine fan, and higher-ups really liked...