SMAX - The Will to Power - mod

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

# Version 53

* Removed dialog option for self-destruct.
* Accumulated nutrients and minerals are adjusted after GROWTH and INDUSTRY SE change to maintain the same completion percentage.

Thus eliminated the exploit of switching to higher INDUSTRY at the very end to build it faster.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

# Version 54

* Set borehole to 0-6-4.
* Fixed Condenser and Enricher calculation and display.

Be careful about this one. I did a lot of patching. Highly experimental.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

# Version 55

* Tube movement rate is a multiplier of road movement rate.

In addition to AI now started to build tubes, their movement rate is restricted also.

[lolada]

Thus eliminated the exploit of switching to higher INDUSTRY at the very end to build it faster.

I didn't count mineral boxes its kind of hard - i presume it works. But rushing edge/exploit is still there that i checked. If you switch to +Industry - and rush it then its way cheaper. Switching is -40 energy and rushing saves much more.

Tube movement rate is a multiplier of road movement rate

What does that mean? ^^ Good to have tubes.

* Set borehole to 0-6-4.
* Fixed Condenser and Enricher calculation and display.

Good borehole change - like that one. I'll check condensers and enricher. I was looking a bit at it last night AI really spams them a lot everywhere. They will certainly influence AI growth significantly.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

I didn't count mineral boxes its kind of hard - i presume it works. But rushing edge/exploit is still there that i checked. If you switch to +Industry - and rush it then its way cheaper. Switching is -40 energy and rushing saves much more.

This is a feature, not exploit. When item is cheaper in minerals it is also cheaper in hurry credits. Direct proportionality. You can think of it as another benefit of INDUSTRY.

Tube movement rate is a multiplier of road movement rate

What does that mean? ^^ Good to have tubes.

Look at last option in thinker.ini. This is how faster movement on tubes comparing to roads. Play with it if you like.

* Set borehole to 0-6-4.
* Fixed Condenser and Enricher calculation and display.

Good borehole change - like that one. I'll check condensers and enricher. I was looking a bit at it last night AI really spams them a lot everywhere. They will certainly influence AI growth significantly.

Yea. As I said I don't have any preference on boreholes. This is more of fans suggested change.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

Other pending changes.

I thought to let artillery duel uses armor as well. However, I don't think it is too relevant. Making artillery armored is still important to protect from direct counter-strikes from air and helicopter, for example.

Same for interceptor duel. No need.

* Make ECM to affect sea units as well.
Interesting feature but too stupid. One can add it to all sea units thus increasing defense against all opponents.

* Cloning Vats should not grant impunities.
That could be fruitful.

[lolada]

You can think of it as another benefit of INDUSTRY.

This is what i call mental gymnastics ^^. Ah well ok I suppose i can stop myself from switching to industry just to exploit that - it should be self-rule.

I thought to let artillery duel uses armor as well. However, I don't think it is too relevant. Making artillery armored is still important to protect from direct counter-strikes from air and helicopter, for example.
Same for interceptor duel. No need.

I've seen these in your todo list, but didn't think much about it - on first look it looks cool.. But it makes some sense to have these units unarmored - they are supposed to be vulnerable to damage. So I don't know would it be good to make them armored.. maybe better not.

* Make ECM to affect sea units as well.

I was thinking at first ECM works vs ship.. btw tooltip said somewhere it works against missile attacks? I thought it affects Missile weapons (there's weapon called like that). Anyway... EMC working vs ships is just yet another way to make player better than AI as AI won't be able to use it as well. So we might be better without this one.

I am also not sure that i like idea of armored formers (AI don't build them), Crawlers (AI builds them) and Probes (AI spams them).

Why?
- these units are non-combat but actually quite strong if armored.... looks stupid
- you get more often than you should spearman kill tank scenario.. Needlejet (or any strong attacking unit for that matter) should have 90% chance to kill Crawler.. not 50% or 30%..
* I think its not issue on transcend WTP - you can't just raid trascend AI in his land (Copters maybe being somewhat exception) you get killed if you stay in their land due to 50% territory malus. Copters also get killed by interceptors btw.. but they are much more deadly than other units when there's no interceptor defense. One can more easily raid weaker AIs.. It would be actually interesting to limit  possible armor on NON-combat units to some lower level. Is it even possible?

- probes... its gamey and it takes some getting used to and it mifgt hurt AI a lot in the end

How do you play against mass probe spam? Took me a bit to figure it. AI likes to attack with  0-10-2 probes in midgame. You don't attack with military units - this is stupid units die. You bombard them a bit and attack with your 0-1-1 or 0-1-2 probe and kill it. If its in your lands you get +50%.. one can just let them attack you - you get 50% def. In their land its harder, but one can bombard more. Also Probe dies when military unit on same tile (or in base dies). There's risk unit will attack probe.. one can attack with probes to remove that 0-10-2 defender and then attack with normal units afterward.
What AI does is attacks them in panic - I've seen multiple times AI emptying his base suiciding into 0-10-2 probe on rough terrain. It would be often much better to have these units defend the base instead of attack.. but there's risk of mind-probe. I did not actually try this tactic - but usually when you have probe under strong defender AI suicides into defender trying to kill the probe. Its not that bad because due to +50% they often manage to kill defender in  few attacks and probe beneath dies. But one can, i think, just bring unarmored probes and bait AI into attacking. I might experiment with this more.

So anyway once player gets used to it - you have to spam ton of probes - and one can just trade probes and kill AI probes with huge efficiency.
Basically it hurts AI in the end. It also hurts AI badly to create ton of 0-10-6 cruiser probes that die to 0-1-1 defenders. These probes are protected from unit attacks - that works AI vs AI mostly.. and it helps them on sea.. player would need to build expensive foil probes - but its just easier to spam 0-1-1 defenders and ignore probes on open waters.

So.. armored probes have one advantage - they are not easily countered by units. But they are huge drain on AI and once player figures it out - they are easily countered with unarmored probes. Armored probes likely do more harm than good to AI.

Same goes for example for that Rover Colony Pod - AI just builds more expensive colony pod when cheap is good enough. AI can't reason when is better to build more expensive one. I suggest removing that design - player can create it if he wants.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

I've seen these in your todo list, but didn't think much about it - on first look it looks cool.. But it makes some sense to have these units unarmored - they are supposed to be vulnerable to damage. So I don't know would it be good to make them armored.. maybe better not.

That a strange way to word it. They are not supposed to be unarmored. Player can either armor them for +50% in cost or save on this. I was just thinking to give them incentive to use armor on artillery/interceptors/needlejets by factoring armor into combat advantage. However, it is not really that important. They already have incentive of protecting them from random retaliation. I think this is enough.

Factoring armor into combat calculation is an interesting idea but it flattens strategical combat. With that there won't be attack and defense anymore. Unit strength would be just sum of weapon and armor strength, always. This is how latest Civ games are made.

Naming them weapon and armor becomes kind of confusing. In Civ it was named attack and defense. Meaning that unit behaves differently in attack and defense which makes sense. In SMACX the weapon/armor (unit component) strength implicitly translates to attack/defense (tactical ability) strength. However, this implicitness is often forgotten and people start arguing about how stronger armor is able to defeat assailant???

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

I am also not sure that i like idea of armored formers (AI don't build them), Crawlers (AI builds them) and Probes (AI spams them).

Why?
- these units are non-combat but actually quite strong if armored.... looks stupid
- you get more often than you should spearman kill tank scenario.. Needlejet (or any strong attacking unit for that matter) should have 90% chance to kill Crawler.. not 50% or 30%..
* I think its not issue on transcend WTP - you can't just raid trascend AI in his land (Copters maybe being somewhat exception) you get killed if you stay in their land due to 50% territory malus. Copters also get killed by interceptors btw.. but they are much more deadly than other units when there's no interceptor defense. One can more easily raid weaker AIs.. It would be actually interesting to limit  possible armor on NON-combat units to some lower level. Is it even possible?

I think so but why? They already had this "non combat units defend at half strength modifier" that I mercilessly removed.
This sounds like one of those "players" requests Sid unsuccessfully tried to please with more and more quirked game behavior. They want game to do what they want. Like they are in a movie theater or something. They are not players, they are spectators.

I'm sure you'll be able to overcome it with advanced strategy and have fun learning it.
😉

Keep in mind that there is nothing unexpected in game. It should not resemble anything else. Not the life nor any other game. Why is it stupid when pawn kills the queen?

I don't see any problem in armoring non combat units for protection. Why on earth one would not??? That absolutely makes sense to invest into armored and Trance crawler and save on rebuilding and repositioning it over and over again.

If you need real life explanation imagine former squad transport not in truck but in refitted tank with all heavy weapon dismantled and only some light weapon left. Then in case of attack they can jump inside and sustain some not so heavy fire and maybe even damage enemy with their light weapon. Yes, it sounds silly to spend extra on protection in peace time but not at all when you work next to enemy line. Again some extra investment may save you other bigger investment in terraforming machinery, etc.

😉

- probes... its gamey and it takes some getting used to and it mifgt hurt AI a lot in the end

How do you play against mass probe spam? Took me a bit to figure it. AI likes to attack with  0-10-2 probes in midgame. You don't attack with military units - this is stupid units die. You bombard them a bit and attack with your 0-1-1 or 0-1-2 probe and kill it. If its in your lands you get +50%.. one can just let them attack you - you get 50% def. In their land its harder, but one can bombard more. Also Probe dies when military unit on same tile (or in base dies). There's risk unit will attack probe.. one can attack with probes to remove that 0-10-2 defender and then attack with normal units afterward.
What AI does is attacks them in panic - I've seen multiple times AI emptying his base suiciding into 0-10-2 probe on rough terrain. It would be often much better to have these units defend the base instead of attack.. but there's risk of mind-probe. I did not actually try this tactic - but usually when you have probe under strong defender AI suicides into defender trying to kill the probe. Its not that bad because due to +50% they often manage to kill defender in  few attacks and probe beneath dies. But one can, i think, just bring unarmored probes and bait AI into attacking. I might experiment with this more.

Exactly, man. You started to figure it out. It is fine to play 5-10 games to get better and better. It is like that sacred moment when you just unpacked you first time SMAC disk!
😝

Yes: bombardment, counter-probes, elevated security, COC, blocking them with air and double stacked units along the roads to slow down their movement and bombard them even more. All the above allows to tilt your probes to enemy probes mortality rate to your favor probably somewhere 2-3 times. Which is the idea of more advantageous defense in this mod.

Basically it hurts AI in the end. It also hurts AI badly to create ton of 0-10-6 cruiser probes that die to 0-1-1 defenders. These probes are protected from unit attacks - that works AI vs AI mostly.. and it helps them on sea.. player would need to build expensive foil probes - but its just easier to spam 0-1-1 defenders and ignore probes on open waters.

Yep. AI is always less efficient. Use it wisely.

So.. armored probes have one advantage - they are not easily countered by units. But they are huge drain on AI and once player figures it out - they are easily countered with unarmored probes. Armored probes likely do more harm than good to AI.

Same goes for example for that Rover Colony Pod - AI just builds more expensive colony pod when cheap is good enough. AI can't reason when is better to build more expensive one. I suggest removing that design - player can create it if he wants.

That's that for AI algorithms. Thinker algorithms are noticeably better but still far from perfection. If you learn to constantly beat them all at Transcend every time - let me know and I'll work on AI to make it even more challenging.
😎

[Hagen0]

I started the game with Morgan. After some turns my bases somehow got a Talent each. I have no idea where those are coming from. (Also I am not sure how I would have managed happiness without those Talents on Transcend.) Do you know why they are there? I build Recycling Tanks and researched Progenitor Psych around the time they appeared.

The start with Morgan is quite slow. It is difficult to build Formers, guards and those expensive colony pods, Morgan's -1 support makes it worse. I nearly lost a base to wildlife for cutting corners. Managing the early game was however quite fun which is a good sign.

[lolada]

@tnevolin haha well said : ) well if AI started to mix unarmored and armored human would found a whole in attacking stack and dismantle it anyway.. we need real artificial intelligence from 2100 : )) imagine smac ai beating you like chess engine beats you wouldn't be much fun when you know you can't win

I started the game with Morgan. After some turns my bases somehow got a Talent each. I have no idea where those are coming from. (Also I am not sure how I would have managed happiness without those Talents on Transcend.) Do you know why they are there? I build Recycling Tanks and researched Progenitor Psych around the time they appeared.

The start with Morgan is quite slow. It is difficult to build Formers, guards and those expensive colony pods, Morgan's -1 support makes it worse. I nearly lost a base to wildlife for cutting corners. Managing the early game was however quite fun which is a good sign.

I picked up police state for awhile with morgan. And you have 0-4-0 mines from beginning in the mod to help with support. Then i got Living Refinery : ). I actually lost a colony pod in my game darn worms ^^ It gets easier when you get Fusion reactor - should be able to get to it quickly - its important to meet AI for trading.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

I started the game with Morgan. After some turns my bases somehow got a Talent each. I have no idea where those are coming from. (Also I am not sure how I would have managed happiness without those Talents on Transcend.) Do you know why they are there? I build Recycling Tanks and researched Progenitor Psych around the time they appeared.

What SE you are using?

[Hagen0]

Planned, everything else on default. I also installed Pracx over the mod executable.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

I picked up police state for awhile with morgan. And you have 0-4-0 mines from beginning in the mod to help with support. Then i got Living Refinery : ). I actually lost a colony pod in my game darn worms ^^ It gets easier when you get Fusion reactor - should be able to get to it quickly - its important to meet AI for trading.

Hmm. It is strange to hear complaints about worms danger to colonies in WtP. How long ago did you play vanilla? All non-combat units have about 50% survival chance against worms in WtP and 0% in vanilla. They are just dead meat in a water there. Whereas in WtP I regularly see colonies, formers, and transports survive natives attacks.

[Alpha Centauri Bear]

Planned, everything else on default. I also installed Pracx over the mod executable.

It's "Planned +" in WtP. 😁
Everything with "+" has hidden +1 TALENT. Unfortunately, it is not visible on SE screen. Therefore I added this sign to name.