So I've been trying to get into programming

[Metaliturtle]

Actually broke down and bought a how to java book and everything.  Would have enrolled in school too but decided the house was a more important next step for my daughter.

Realize I have next to no coding experience but would be cool to have a place to

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code with feedback.  Any of the rest of you Java experts?

[Buster's Uncle]

Uh, Draz is around and his power is max.  Yitzi is quite scientific.  I may PM a few people for you tonight, and point them here.

[Metaliturtle]

I'd like to think if I put stuff publicly I'll get better feedback.  Realize my code's going to be like someone's first time speaking English...

[Lorizael]

I've been programming for ~15 years, but never seriously. I taught myself a little Java around this time last year, but I'm by no means an expert.

[Metaliturtle]

I'll take it, what were your obstacles getting into programming?  What would you do different?

[Yitzi]

I haven't learned Java...but learning a language is probably one of the smaller parts of learning to program.  The real question (at least when starting) is whether you can take your goal and break it up into the necessary steps.

[Unorthodox]

Disagree to a point on the language barrier.  I was fairly adept at basic way back in the day, but jumped from an Apple IIe to a Windows 98 machine, and then didn't attempt coding until trying to build a website not too long ago.  While I can take a simple program someone's written in most of the new languages today and alter it to do something I want, I could no longer build something from the ground up, the language has passed me by.  (and I'm afraid the whole move to getting things to work well on smartphone crap is beyond me entirely, going to have to find something off the shelf soon and not fiddle)

It's like trying to speak Italian based on a scientific understanding of Latin.  Give me time and I can work out what's being said, but I couldn't just start speaking to someone. 

Ironically, I have to explain basic to youngens regularly, and they have a similarly difficult time grasping it. 

[Buster's Uncle]

I was an early adapter -had a TRS Coco in 1981- and I got good enough in Basic that Mylochka depended on me debugging her programs.  She actually had a far greater command of the language, but I have these pedant/OCD tendencies (that I can mostly turn off and not have them cause me problems when I don't need them, but they're there) to bring to bear on a tedious logic problem.

And like Uno, time has passed me by - the most complex programming I ever actually wrote was to add a random move function to an Othello two-player program that wouldn't allow illegal moves - and amusingly, it was a terrible opponent, but Mylochka lost a lot against it.  No doubt for the same reason I was debugging for her barely knowing Basic.  Weird difference in aptitude for two people who often think so much alike.  -And no one who ever saw her working away for hours sewing hair into a Barbie head, or working on her Poser art would be deluded that she has no capacity for patiently juggling a lot of niggling detail.

Gamera, Mylochka is Buster's Aunt.

[Lorizael]

I'll take it, what were your obstacles getting into programming?  What would you do different?

I semi-agree with the two semi-contradictory points made above. A lot about programming in general is learning the kinds of commands a computer can take, which are fairly standard across programming languages and differ only in syntax. For example, most computer languages have a way to repeat a particular piece of code until X happens, whatever X is. If you know that that's the kind of solution you want for a particular problem, then oftentimes the rest is just figuring out how to implement that in a particular language.

On the other hand, and getting at your questions, one of the reasons why I never got serious about programming is because it's very easy to program in a little isolated sandbox universe, but much more complicated to actually take something you've built and have it interact with the rest of the world. When I was programming as a kid (in QBasic), I didn't particularly care much about whether my program could be used by other people, or interact with websites, or anything of that. I just wanted to play my RPG/space fighter/Connect 4. And I can still do just that if I want to, even with C or Java. But if I want to do something that exists in our internety world, it's all much more complicated and I'm fairly lost.

[Metaliturtle]

and that is sort of the thing.  I want to get into a career with it because I'm predicting my job is one that will be replaced by a machine in my lifetime.  I'd like to be able to master the machinery before it becomes my master.

[Buster's Uncle]

[Metaliturtle]

So to start, anyone know any simple to program games that may teach fundamentals?

[Metaliturtle]

So I've been messing around at work with excel (because you can program in it and they pay me to get better at excel).  I created a monster fighting game, pretty basic really, program generates 3 random numbers for each monster and the one who wins 2/3 wins the fight.  (and as I'm typing this I have no idea what happens in case of a tie...)  I also set variables so I could 'level up' the monsters so Monster A wins I'd improve his strength by one giving him a random number between 1-20 +1.

[Buster's Uncle]

Post in Other Games - you can upload here: http://alphacentauri2.info/index.php?action=downloads

I'm serious.

[Metaliturtle]

I will, my 'program' is at work though lol.