Transgender bathrooms?

[Elok]

When I got married back in '09, my folks sprang for a cake from a very nice bakery--the guy who ran it used to be pastry chef at the Watergate.  That was a good frickin' cake, lemme tell you.  Raspberry buttercream between every layer.  I sat down with the man and his wife and discussed what I'd like for it beforehand, to establish a price, etc.

If, for some reason, he had told me he could not make it because of some aspect of my marriage he disliked--my wife, my religion, me, whatever--I would have thought he was a knob, and gone off to get a cake from somebody else.  The idea of threatening him with a lawsuit because he wouldn't create a pastry for me would have struck me as absurd.  I'm not superstitious, but why on earth would I want part of my wedding done by someone who reviled the whole thing, and only did it under fear of ruin by the law?  Better to have no cake at all.  I cannot believe such things are done out of any motives other than spite or vengeance.  The law should not be a vehicle for people to vent their wounded pride by ruining their personal enemies, whatever the provocation.

[Buster's Uncle]

Oh, no doubt at all about that - and CSM piece seemed pretty clear that the fellow was pressured into it by political crusaders...

[Buster's Uncle]

So Elok, I can be pretty thick, but it's finally penetrated that you keep allowing as you don't much want to talk about this and, much as I'd like to understand where you're coming better, I'm basically dropping it as far as you're concerned.  I don't want to be That Guy - I respect you too much, for one thing.  The whole business -flowers and bathrooms alike- sucks for everyone; we agree on that.

[Elok]

It's more that it sucks me in and makes me angry, and I want to avoid getting myself worked up.  But thank you.

[Buster's Uncle]

It makes me feel unhappy and kind of sick at heart myself - avoiding being angry, I totally get, and yeah; I didn't want to seem to accuse/attack/condescend, and so left that part out, but you seemed angry.  Being angry sucks and blah blah blah.  Peace out, Y'all!

[Bearu]

I think we found a psychological trigger for Elok, and the presence of a safe space would help to alleviate the traumatic effects of the subject.   

[Buster's Uncle]

Hey man - don't.

[Buster's Uncle]

#GayUnclesDay: Hashtag Campaign Encourages Making Aug. 14 a Day to Celebrate Gay Uncles

[Buster's Uncle]

Having older brothers increases men's likelihood of being gay
By Jen Christensen, CNNUpdated 6:42 AM ET, Tue December 12, 2017


Story highlights
Scientists say mothers who have more than one boy had higher concentrations of a certain protein
Earlier studies have noticed that gay men often have older brothers



 (CNN) — If you're a guy with an older brother, there's an increased chance you're gay.

Scientists have noticed this pattern in previous research, but now they think they have a biological explanation as to why, and it starts long before birth. The results were published in the journal PNAS on Monday.

The researchers say that if their findings can be replicated, we may know at least one of the biological reasons some men are gay.

Many factors may determine someone's sexual orientation, but in this case, researchers noticed a pattern that may be linked to something that happens in the womb. The phenomenon is related to a protein linked to the Y chromosome (which women do not have) that is important to male brain development.

Researchers think it's possible that when a woman gets pregnant with her first boy, this Y-linked protein gets into her bloodstream. The mother's body recognizes the protein as a foreign substance, and her immune system responds, creating antibodies. If enough of these antibodies build up in the woman's body and she gets pregnant with another a boy, they can cross the placental barrier and enter the brain of the second male fetus.

"That may alter the functions in the brain, changing the direction of how the male fetus may later develop their sense of attraction," said study author Anthony Bogaert, a Canadian psychologist and professor in the departments of psychology and community health sciences at Brock University.

Earlier research has shown that the more older brothers a boy has, the more of a chance that boy will be attracted to men. A 2006 study showed that with each brother, the chance that a man will be gay goes up by about a third, but the researchers didn't determine why that was.

Bogaert and his co-authors tested a small group of 142 women and 12 men ages 18 to 80 and found a higher concentration of antibodies to the protein, known as NLGN4Y, in blood samples from women than from men. They found the highest concentration of antibodies to the protein in women with gay younger sons who had older brothers, compared with women who had no sons or who had given birth to only heterosexual boys.

The study builds on research Bogaert and his co-authors have been exploring for more than 20 years. Since their initial research that noted the trend, other research -- although not all studies -- have detected the phenomenon, even across cultures. One found that a man's chances of being gay increased even if he was raised apart from his older brother.

Researchers did not see a similar pattern in families with adopted brothers, so scientists started to think there must be a maternal developmental explanation. The research does not give a biological explanation for why some men may be bisexual or may not be attracted to anyone at all, nor can it give a biological explanation for gay only children, gay oldest sons or women who are attracted to women.

J. Michael Bailey, a professor in the Department of Psychology at Northwestern University, thinks the latest research is important. "It is significant, and I believe science granting agencies should put a high priority into additional research to see if this is true," he said.

Bailey was not involved in the new study but has worked on studies that have found genetic factors that may explain some differences in sexual orientations.

Bailey's latest paper, published this month in the journal Nature Research, looked at people's genomes and found several regions with single-letter DNA changes that were more common among gay men than straight men and may be relevant to the development of sexual orientation. Bailey believes this new study may be even more significant than general genetic findings if the findings can be replicated.

"Our studies only show that there may be genes that matter in sexual orientation," he said. "It is not like this study, that shows there is a potential specific mechanism by which sexual orientation may have changed prenatally. This is important work and fascinating if it proves to be true."

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/11/health/men-older-brothers-gay-study/index.html

[Unorthodox]

We have a transgender man working here now, and the bathroom issue has come up at work.  Corporate position:  Whatever he wants to use. 

Workforce is very mixed on this.  I've seen him in both, which initially surprised me, but I think it's more a prefers the women's room but will use the mens if the womens is full situation than a 'today I feel like a man'. 

Personally couldn't care less, he's a nice guy and helps me make my boss uncomfortable. 

[Spacy]

Everybody pees and poos.
I doubt anybody has not seen the bits and pieces before (even if just on an underwear commercial).
And it is among the last places anybody would want to pick someone else up (unless they got some odd fetish).

Really, I find it hard to believe outside a school (where, you have to consider the maturity level of the student population) that it is an issue.

[Unorthodox]

And it is among the last places anybody would want to pick someone else up (unless they got some odd fetish).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cottaging

[Geo]

And it is among the last places anybody would want to pick someone else up (unless they got some odd fetish).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cottaging

 

Having older brothers increases men's likelihood of being gay

I'm the eldest! 

[Buster's Uncle]

...Let me point out, though, that by any reasonable Christian standard, being married by a judge is not a real marriage - is it?  Is it not tacit complicity in something against your beliefs to contribute to ANY wedding not before a preacher man of a denomination you don't find hopelessly blasphemous in its doctrine?  Like, flowers arrangements for a Christian Science-officiated wedding is wrong for the nice church lady, according to her own lights if only she'd thought it through.

I mean, marriage is a religious issue right? (A legal own-goal every time you shrill it out, social "conservatives") and that nice brown Hindu couple you know isn't really married, whether it's any of your business or not -and your uncle and his 'wife' who went before a judge are openly living in sin- or it's live and let live, and Mark and Steve's legal arrangement is really, REALLY none of your business.  You can't pick and choose about what Jesus, who I don't recall ever discussing what marriage is, wants.

Hey Elok - I think maybe I've given you reasonable time to cool off --- I'd really like a response to this point, leaving aside the issue it was embedded in...