Interesting fact about drone riots

[Yitzi]

Unlike civil disorder in earlier Civilization games, drone riots do not stop the production of tech in a base.  They stop mineral production, but not nutrients, tech, or (I think) income.

[Kirov]

Interesting, and funny I never knew that (I thought it's precisely like in Civ, besides you get  that 'non-essential functions suspended' or something). And yes, I checked the income thing and you get money as normal.

This test showed me also another interesting bit - drone riots at your HQ never intensify, at least not for the 50 turns I clicked through. Although in the Big Book of Useless and Least Practical Info, this would probably get the first page.

[JarlWolf]

Not necessarily, if you plan on attrition style warfare its good to know. And thus I deem it good to know because thats my style of combat xD

[Kirov]

Hmm, love to have helped, but I still don't see it. Can you give me a picture of a situation in which you'd use it, i.e. deliberately went into or just left drone riots undisturbed at your HQ? You still lose production, of course. If you're so war-oriented, I say nerve-staple the bastards.

[Yitzi]

I think he means more to know that it's less worthwhile to incite drone riots at the enemy's HQ.

[Kirov]

Oh, see. Still, good luck with planning intensified drone riots at enemy bases. As a victim, I'd rather starve down (or nerve staple) my rioting base that let it go on with it, so the only feasible scenario of actually planning that for the enemy would be to pick at least a medium pop base, target-and-destroy the Rec Commons in one turn and then (when the victim picks up two workers) target-and-destroy the Holo Theatre or whatever he's got there. Way too much fuss, if you ask me, and you're not even guaranteed the intensification effects after the second turn.

Which brings me to a question - Yitzi, is it possible to read the code to see the effects of prolonged riots? Sometimes it's nothing, sometimes it's a fac destroyed, sometimes it's the base defecting right away. What are the odds and are they permanent or depend on something? We may want to run some tests.

And how does the game pick the faction your base defects to? I checked an old save, with the Hive and Domai both present, although the former way stronger (and closer), and my (Morgan) bases which underwent longer riots, all joined the Hive. So I can't believe there is a 1 to 6 roll with a bonus for Domai, there must be a formula here, possibly taking into account the might and distance, perhaps also relations.

[JarlWolf]

Typically I never have too much issues with citizen happiness, as Yitzi said its more of focusing on inducing attrition. Mind I have used drone rioting in the past to weaken bases, but more so that it converts to me easier. (I play Free Drones lots.)

But this sort of confirmed my experience: I've always found the probe team option of inciting riots not too useful.

[Yitzi]

Which brings me to a question - Yitzi, is it possible to read the code to see the effects of prolonged riots? Sometimes it's nothing, sometimes it's a fac destroyed, sometimes it's the base defecting right away. What are the odds and are they permanent or depend on something? We may want to run some tests.

And how does the game pick the faction your base defects to? I checked an old save, with the Hive and Domai both present, although the former way stronger (and closer), and my (Morgan) bases which underwent longer riots, all joined the Hive. So I can't believe there is a 1 to 6 roll with a bonus for Domai, there must be a formula here, possibly taking into account the might and distance, perhaps also relations.

It is possible to read the code; I've got other projects right now (as always), but I might take the time sometime to read it and let you know.

[Yitzi]

Ok, I've read the code, and it's a good thing I did, as it seems to have several bugs (one of which is responsible for Domai's bonus not working).  Here's how it does it:

1. First, of course, it checks whether drone riots already existed.  If not, they don't intensify, and you lose production and morale but nothing more. 
2. If there already were drone riots, then it checks for riots intensifying.  The probability of riots intensifying is 1/(POLICE+7), where POLICE is the base's POLICE rating (brood pits do have an effect.)  POLICE in this case has a lower cap of -6 (for certain intensification), and no upper cap.  However, if it has the HQ, or is your only base (even without the HQ), or has at least 45 left on the "turns to assimilation" counter (i.e. was captured within the last 5 turns, although for very large bases this can also happen due to Incite Drone Riots), it cannot intensify.  If the base is population 3 or less, there's a 2 in 3 chance that it will not intensify even if it otherwise would.
3. Having determined that drone riots intensify, it next tries to find which facility to destroy.  It does this in (almost) the most obvious way: It picks a "facility" at random (counting the "empty facilities", satellites, stockpile energy, and the undefined facility in slot 0.)  If the base has that facility, not due to a faction power or project, it is destroyed.  If not, it picks again a certain number of times.
4. The number of tries depends on a number of factors: There's 1 try per population, plus a number of tries depending on difficulty (1 at transcend up to 6 at citizen), plus a number of tries depending on your faction ranking (1 for the top spot, up to 7 at the bottom spot.)  If all the tries fail to find a facility to destroy, the base revolts instead.
5. A base cannot revolt if it is an alien faction or AI-controlled, or has a POLICE rating of -2 or better.  In such case, nothing happens if it doesn't find a facility to destroy.
6. If the base can revolt, it next finds the faction to revolt to.  This uses one of two methods: Either based on the REVOLT abilities of factions in the game, or based on other factors.
7. To determine the REVOLT abilities of factions in the game, use the first REVOLT entry (if there's more than one.)  If there are no REVOLT entries for a faction, set a value depending on stuff leftover from other parts of the program; if any of them are over 100 (highly likely), it does not revolt based on the REVOLT values.  If any of them are negative, things can get even more broken.  (I think this is clearly a bug, and the one causing your problem.)
8. To determine whether to base it off the REVOLT abilities, apply each faction's bonus separately.  (So if two factions with a 50% bonus are in the game, the chance it'll go based on those abilities is 75%, not 100%.)  If any of them gets it, go to step 9, otherwise go to step 10.
9. Now, pick a random number from 1 to 100, and start "stacking up" each faction's bonus (starting with the first faction that has a positive bonus); whichever one the random number lands on is the one that gets it.  If the total values add to more than 100, tough luck for those on the bottom of the list.  If the total values add to less than 100, start over from the beginning.  (I'm pretty sure this is a bug too, and it should just pick a random number from 1 to the total and then pick randomly from there, i.e. each has a chance of getting it proportional to their bonus.)  It is possible for it to end up back with the original owner in this manner.
10. If not using the REVOLT abilities, check if it is a conquered base.  If it is, it reverts to its former owner.
11. If it is not a conquered base, look at each base (other than those owned by the revolting base's current owner) in turn, and calculate the distance to the revolting base.  Modify by the relationship between the revolting base's owner and the owner of the owner of the closest base so far: Halve if there's a truce but no treaty, double if there's a treaty, and triple (instead of doubling) if there's a pact.  If the result is closer than the closest base so far, this becomes the closest base (with the modified "distance".)  Whichever base is closest at the end gets the revolting base.  (I'm pretty sure the bolded part is a bug, as it means that it matters which order things are calculated in; it probably should be the relationship between the revolting base's owner and the owner of the base whose distance is being calculated.)

[Kirov]

OK, I understand it only to point 6. To make the long story short, a base can secede only under FM when a facility was not destroyed, so bases with a low number of facs but high population (which increases the number of tries) are the most vulnerable.

I'm only surprised by the manner SMAC looks for facs to be destroyed. Why can't it roll a dice for facs already existing at a given base, but instead has a separate list and rolls against that?

Anyhow, you lost me at REVOLT abilities - I don't know what it is in-game. Also REVOLT entries, also 'stuff leftovers' (), what sort of bonuses factions have... All I understand so far is that factions which are closer and have better relations are more likely to get the base. And you mentioned the Domai bonus doesn't work, so there's that.

Oh, and AI bases never revolt, so good luck aiming for that. That's actually really bad news, inducing riots to get a base should be a nice viable strategy.

Anyway, thanks for your work, Yitzi, please elaborate on the above when you have time.

[Yitzi]

OK, I understand it only to point 6. To make the long story short, a base can secede only under FM

Cybernetic works too.

so bases with a low number of facs but high population (which increases the number of tries) are the most vulnerable.

Pretty much.

I'm only surprised by the manner SMAC looks for facs to be destroyed. Why can't it roll a dice for facs already existing at a given base, but instead has a separate list and rolls against that?

And then have a separate check for revolution?  I suppose it could have been done that way, but it isn't.  (It'd also be harder to code, but quite doable.)

Anyhow, you lost me at REVOLT abilities - I don't know what it is in-game.

That's what the Drones get, where a revolting base is 75% likely to join them.

Also REVOLT entries

By that, I just mean an entry in the faction bonuses that gives them a Drone-like bonus.  So if you put in a 50% chance and then a 60% chance, it ignores the later one.

also 'stuff leftovers' ()

A bug that will be fixed; it's why the Domai bonus doesn't work.

All I understand so far is that factions which are closer and have better relations are more likely to get the base.

No, actually it's factions which are closer and have worse relations are more likely to get the base, though truce is more likely than vendetta.

Oh, and AI bases never revolt, so good luck aiming for that. That's actually really bad news, inducing riots to get a base should be a nice viable strategy.

Later on, I may add it as an option if there's request for it.

[Kirov]

That's what the Drones get, where a revolting base is 75% likely to join them.

Yes, but do other factions differ as to this feature? Is it that Domai has 75 and others are at plain zero, or something else?

Other than that, I think we're more or less clear. If nobody has the revolt bonus, then we compare distance+relations. Fine. It's funny that a base can 'revolt' to the original owner, if I read point 9 correctly.

Oh, point 7 - what does it mean that things can get even more broken?

[Yitzi]

That's what the Drones get, where a revolting base is 75% likely to join them.

Yes, but do other factions differ as to this feature? Is it that Domai has 75 and others are at plain zero, or something else?

It's supposed to be that Domai has 75 and the others don't have it (i.e. they're ignored for that purpose).  In actuality, the bug means that Domai has 75 and some of the others have "make the whole thing not work properly"

Other than that, I think we're more or less clear. If nobody has the revolt bonus, then we compare distance+relations. Fine. It's funny that a base can 'revolt' to the original owner, if I read point 9 correctly.

Yes; if Domai's base revolts, there is a 75% chance he'll get it right back (if I've read the code correctly.)

Oh, point 7 - what does it mean that things can get even more broken?

Stuff like increasing the chance that it will go to someone based on Domai's special ability.  In any case, that bug will be fixed in version 2.2 of my patch.

[Rymdolov]

Nice to hear that you found this bug, since revolts are among the coolest things in SMAX.

[Kirov]

Nice to hear that you found this bug, since revolts are among the coolest things in SMAX.

Interesting, in my games they are virtually non-existent. I always preferred to starve a base than to let it riot, and I discovered a long time ago that inducing the revolt in AI is not a worthwhile strategy... It was obvious that the AI enjoys some bonuses as its bases can riot for many turns and still churn out units, but it is only now that Yitzi discovered the AI immunity that I understand it. Many a probe perished to hurt AI, but I never suspected such blatant cheating.