Star Wars VII-IX, what do you think?

[bvanevery]

I don't think Star Wars is going to end, because they're doing enough to keep it going, despite any specific person's objections.  Heck it kept going even with the godawful prequels, and let's face it, the seeds of destruction were laid with the Ewoks.

I have different objections to Kylo and Ren than you do.  I don't buy their combat abilities, they haven't had enough training time.  Luke at least had to earn some skills, and Anakin did spend a lot of time kicking butt by his master's side before becoming the universal dice master.  Anakin also almost got killed once due to overcockiness.  I accept that Ren is pretty good with a staff already, but translating that immediately into lightsaber prowess is quite a stretch.  We don't really know enough about Kylo to know why he should even be able to fight at all, although he did spend time with Luke.

Kylo could potentially be interesting, in that he doesn't really want to deal with Light or Dark sides of the Force at all.  But the films haven't alotted the time to deal with those themes yet.  I hope that isn't just dropped as a passing moment.

[Elok]

Well, it's dead for me.  They'll keep churning out more SW until there's no more money in it, but I don't feel the need to follow any more.  It's just another franchise now, and not even a particularly good one.

[bvanevery]

Well why follow any franchise really?

[Mart]

They create history of the SW Galaxy in other eras, than those from main movies, also. KOTOR games, which are approx. 4000 years before movies, later SWTOR, which is like 3800 - 3750 before movies. There is even that book taking place 25000 years before.
It is decent sci-fi, all these things. And they have potential to create more interesting stories. For me there is one thing in particular very interesting. Slow technological development. In KOTOR many things seem very similar like in movies era. I do not agree with some explanations, that it was empires falling and then reemerging what caused technological reversals. The Jedi was, after all, for 1000 generations active, it is like these 25-20 thousands of years.


This will make you to belong to generation tech:

! No longer available

[Green1]

Well, everything has a bubble. Even geekidom past times such as Star Wars.

First, you have the abnormals. The pioneers that try new things that fly over the heads of the normies. They are ridiculed at first by normal society.

They form clubs and conventions and all number of things. They have tons of fun! You have a few who are generally more knowledgeable than others. Some can quote every line verbatim. Some have every bit of 1980s plastic crap put out by Kenner Toys. Some have decoration sense that would make AC2's Unorthodox blush and can make convincing dress becoming certain characters.  But, as a whole everyone has something in common. You are able to find buddies, friends, mates, whatever due to the fact of your love for the Sci Fi world of Star Wars. People actually meet lifelong friends, wives, you name it off of geekdom.

Then other people jump in hearing about this. The same types of girls who made fun of your kind now "cosplays" with clothes that cost more than some people make in a month while not really wanting anything to do with the culture. Entrepreneurs come in, hoping to capitalize and make a living in a genre that sure as hell beats corporate hell. Your fun little fan skits get taken over by big time, big money professionals. Add to that, now even Mr. backwards six pack beer NASCAR dude loves him some Star Wars and shows up at the fray and they become fans. Lonely, awkward World of Warcraft basement dweller gets the memo 10 years too late  shows up and hits on rich cosplay girl pisses her off. Everybody talks geek, but no one is a geek anymore. Everybody is out there to get something, few are in it for what it originally was.

The room parties, that used to be open to everyone, become exclusive. They only want rich cosplay modelling career girl and dude, entrepreneur merchandise dude, and professional actor dude there. Everybody else solely exists to pump money.

As a result, the new people and the old veterans get mad. They are disempowered. This were not the droids they were looking for.... Ineffectual old heroes? 15 dollar mixed drinks at the movie theatre? Model geek girls with fan casts trying to get ad view money? Never mind the quality was better than the prequels and the Last Jedi is probably one of the deepest Star Wars movie to ever hit. This is not the Star Wars they wanted.

Now, don't get me wrong. I hope everybody gets to make money or making a living on stuff that excludes corporate oppression. But, these bubbles happen all the time to everything. It happened to swing ballroom dancing in the 90s, New Age movements like Wicca in the early 00s, "alternative" music, and many other crazes.

It is what it is.

[Elok]

I don't do conventions or cosplay; I've never written SW fan fiction, collected toys, or any of that other stuff that constitutes membership in a geek subculture.  It was a fun set of movies in an interesting setting about characters I liked.  Now the characters I liked are dead, their replacements are boring, and the stories they're telling in that setting don't interest me any more.  That's all.  You don't need to (badly) psychoanalyze my deeper motives.

[Green1]

I don't do conventions or cosplay; I've never written SW fan fiction, collected toys, or any of that other stuff that constitutes membership in a geek subculture.  It was a fun set of movies in an interesting setting about characters I liked.  Now the characters I liked are dead, their replacements are boring, and the stories they're telling in that setting don't interest me any more.  That's all.  You don't need to (badly) psychoanalyze my deeper motives.

No... not your motives. Just the movement in general. You have not even seen it yet.

[Elok]

I'm not part of "the movement," and never was.

[Elok]

At any rate, it would be silly to impute some kind of virginal, pure state to Star Wars, of all things.  It was a massive cash-in from the word go, with oodles of merchandise, much of it of very poor quality.  In 1998 or thereabouts they released Shadows of the Empire, a coordinated campaign to do a movie merchandising blitz without even making a movie in the first place.  It was all money-grubbing, every bit of it.  Nor was it ever any kind of underground scene; it was massively popular on release and remained massively popular for years after.

[Green1]

Of course it WAS a cash grab.

I am just talking the geek movement in general.

[E_T]

You'll laugh, you'll cry... you'll kiss 3 bucks goodbye...

https://youtu.be/ccfbw2RJ3ow

[bvanevery]

Hardware Wars da bomb!  Or da basketball?  Not sure which.

Elok, what franchises do you currently like?  I'd be mildly interested to calibrate your expectations of Star Wars vs. anything else.  Myself, I actually think Star Trek: The Original Series is better than Star Wars in some ways, although not in others.

[Elok]

Star Wars vs. Star Trek is apples and oranges.  I dislike basically every series out in theaters right now.  I followed the Marvel Cinematic Universe for a while, but after a while I realized I was only watching for the two or three action sequences, since the plots were uniformly dull.  So I just watch the action scenes on YouTube when I feel like it.  Really, I think most movie series these days are overproduced trash, for reasons I don't want to get into right now.  As for series I do like, I followed The Venture Brothers for a while there, before I had kids and couldn't keep up any more.  The original Star Trek was indeed wonderful in its goofy way, though I was never a hardcore Trekkie.  I love Firefly, except of course for the whorehouse rescue episode.

[Lorizael]

I love Firefly, except of course for the whorehouse rescue episode.

I watched the series once years ago, and I remember there being an episode with whores, but I don't associate it with being obviously bad. What am I not remembering?

[Elok]

Well, it had a guy in a very shiny jacket mounting a military assault on a whorehouse from Luke's landspeeder, firing a laser pistol out the open top.  With the Serenity crew boarded up inside, shooting out the windows.  There were some powerful shark-jumping vibes about that episode.  Like Mal's wince-inducing sexual healing with the madam.  To be fair, it also had some fun moments with Jayne, because whorehouse, but when I revisit the series, I watch that episode last.  Even after the one that's all flashbacks.

EDIT: Also, that episode was naturally rather heavy on the Inara.  Inara was always at least a little bit annoying just from Baccarin's acting, and when you throw on her lah-di-dah space geisha hokum, uck.  She was most tolerable when she was fighting with Mal.  Heart of Gold had her trying to be serious and dramatic.  Which was simply painful.