IRAQ WAR III

[vonbach]

You have a reliable source for any of this?

Heh. I know people that could literally teach on the subject of WW2. I also know people that
have spoken to GI's that were there.
Yes I have sources. Just read gruesome harvest or a terrible revenge or a woman in Berlin.
Or for that matter you could read Icebreaker the book from a Russian
general that proves the Germans beat the Soviet invasion by two weeks.
Then theres this little gem from Ilya Grigoryevich Ehrenburg.

"Kill! Kill! In the German race there is nothing but evil; not one among the living, not one among the yet unborn but is evil! Follow the precepts of Comrade Stalin. Stamp out the fascist beast once and for all in its lair! Use force and break the racial pride of these German women. Take them as your lawful booty. Kill! As you storm onward, kill, you gallant soldiers of the Red Army."

Every single German woman had the exact same stories to tell about the Russians behavior.
For that matter there are pictures taken in broad daylight. Patton was seriously considering invading
the USSR and he would have succeeded.
But honestly I really don't feel like getting into this.

[Yitzi]

You have a reliable source for any of this?

Heh. I know people that could literally teach on the subject of WW2. I also know people that
have spoken to GI's that were there.

And what, exactly, did they say.

Yes I have sources. Just read gruesome harvest or a terrible revenge or a woman in Berlin.

Those all sound like they're talking about how horrible the Soviets were, which I don't deny.  But even if they were among the worst people ever to live...the Nazis were even worse than that.

[vonbach]

Those all sound like they're talking about how horrible the Soviets were, which I don't deny.  But even if they were among the worst people ever to live...the Nazis were even worse than that.

Except for the 66 million people the Soviets killed and the 2.5 million German women they raped.
Theres no comparing the two its just silly.

[Yitzi]

Those all sound like they're talking about how horrible the Soviets were, which I don't deny.  But even if they were among the worst people ever to live...the Nazis were even worse than that.

Except for the 66 million people the Soviets killed and the 2.5 million German women they raped.

But at least their reasons for killing people weren't quite as evil as the racism and post-moralism of the Nazis.

In any case, my main point is that, even though we could have stayed out of WWII, it was still the right move to get involved and fight evil.  If you'd rather make that point about getting involved in the cold war instead, we can do that instead.

[Rusty Edge]

Tonight the President addressed us from the Oval Office.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/12/06/politics/transcript-obama-san-bernardino-isis-address/
As per usual- nice speech.

It almost sounded like he was asking Congress to declare war.

"Finally, if Congress believes, as I do, that we are at war with ISIL, it should go ahead and vote to authorize the continued use of military force against these terrorists. For over a year, I have ordered our military to take thousands of airstrikes against ISIL targets. I think it's time for Congress to vote to demonstrate that the American people are united, and committed, to this fight."

He also said-

"Our success won't depend on tough talk, or abandoning our values, or giving into fear. That's what groups like ISIL are hoping for. Instead, we will prevail by being strong and smart, resilient and relentless, and by drawing upon every aspect of American power. "

Fine words. Really fine words. But values are some of the first casualties of war. It sounds like he's calling for infringements of the 2nd Amendment at the same time as he's calling for protecting religious freedom and immigration. That's something that's likely to divide us, rather than unite us.