pandora update

[Unorthodox]

But to tell you the truth, If I was to make AC2, I'd get rid of the factions feature.  Select ideologies or aspects of ideologies over the course of the game.

If you were talking Civilization, I'd actually agree with you, but I think the factions, and the personalities therein is one of the best things of AC.

[Green1]

But to tell you the truth, If I was to make AC2, I'd get rid of the factions feature.  Select ideologies or aspects of ideologies over the course of the game.

If you were talking Civilization, I'd actually agree with you, but I think the factions, and the personalities therein is one of the best things of AC.

Not just that, but the way they interact in diplomacy. I would put AC/X's diplomacy up against even modern efforts. IPlus, when you compare the diplomacy of games of that era, there is no comparison.

I remember a thread on another board where a writer for Triumph games (Age of Wonders series) was asking the community about characters. I said that the different leaders of AoW felt like they were not real folks. The only difference between, say, Merlin or Nekron was a different spell list and race. But AC, each leader feels alive like a real person with real agendas and totally different playstyle. The dialogue and backstory matches. Plus, unlike some 4xs, AC does not need a "campaign" mode with scripted events to tell backstories. You crank up a random map and like characters out of Shakesphere a play begins.

In order to capture and be the spiritual successor to AC, a game must do that or else it is just another 4x.

[Buster's Uncle]

You articulate the point extremely well, sir.

[Zoid]

I´m not ready to write off this just yet, but then I´m not a die hard AC-puritan... 

[BlaneckW]

If you were talking Civilization, I'd actually agree with you, but I think the factions, and the personalities therein is one of the best things of AC.

Also the least likely thing to be made decently.  Imperium!  Bet you that has a whole lot of thought behind it!

[JarlWolf]

Someone mention Imperium?

[Green1]

A lot of this is going to be how easy it is for modders to get a hold of it and tweak it.

Almost all the great 4x games, past and present, have survived in good part because of modders.

It would be interesting, too. A modern and scaled 3D Civ 5 style Alpha Centauri?

[JarlWolf]

This game will reach success if it can allow you to create your own custom factions, like you select bonuses in some sort of editor, change colour and select an appearance from amongst the one's available, and some superficial things like names etc.

And if the game is easy to mod, the two combined will be easy to re-create Alpha Centauri with.

[BlaneckW]

My gripe was with the scope of tech tree.

[Earthmichael]

Pandora is far less complex that SMAC.

On the positive side:

I like the hex grid. 
I like the graphics. 
I like the resources pools. 
I like the complete wrap around maps.

It would have been much better if they had just taken SMAX and adapted it to resources pools, a hex grid, and updated the graphics.



On the negative side:

I have made a ton of suggestions.  Only a couple have been implemented to date.  Some that seem very easy to implement and very important as well, such as defining hot keys for movement, have not been done, and I have no visibility as to whether the feature is even being considered.  I do know moving each unit with the mouse is pretty tedious in late game.

The tech tree gets randomized each game.  This could be a good thing to vary strategies a bit.  I would rather have the option of a standard (sensible) tech tree and only get the randomized tech tree if the option is selected.  Forced randomization is what makes me list this on the negative side.  I would rather have the option.

The AI is very bad at fighting.  AI diplomacy is total nonsense.

Multiplayer does not work yet, so I cannot give any assessment of networking.

The game has no governments or social factors.  No secret projects or equivalents.

You can only get a single kind resource from a square, no matter how many different resources the square produces, so forests are a waste.  Instead of allocating workers to squares, you have to decide how many workers are allocated to farming, how many to mining, and how many to science.

Frankly, the game is much less complex and much less strategic that SMAC.  That may appeal to some people, but I was attracted to SMAC by the strategic options and complexity.

What would be great is a version of SMAX that uses the Pandora graphics, hex grid, and global resource pools.  To me, Pandora does not satisfy by desire for a SMAX 2.

Right now, I find the game pretty boring with just the AIs.  Hopefully, when they get multiplayer working, the game will be more interesting, due to the variety of strategy that human players can bring to the game.

[BlaneckW]

Hopefully, when they get multiplayer working, the game will be more interesting, due to the variety of strategy that human players can bring to the game.

I appreciate your report, but I don't really believe that multiplayer by itself would make it purchasable.  Without a sociological aspect, preferably more developed than AC, it's just a weak (and at the moment, ai-less) civ-styled wargame, unlike, say, the AOW series, which is a good civ(master of magic...)-like wargame.  One can do the whole rock-paper-scissors thing better elsewhere, and if you want flavor, AOW campaign, at least, has more RPG aspects and story-depth than many CRPGs.  Alpha Centauri is notable for it's sociological aspects.  I hope that you forum-goers can convince them to make their priority the improvement of AI, or at least it's modability, and ensure modability overall so that someone else can make their game.

[Vishniac]

Though they are listed as dating from May 31 and June 13 there are updates on the Pandora home page (http://www.matrixgames.com/products/435/details/Pandora:.First.Contact) that I didn't see last week.
- a developper explanation for the tech tree mechanism
- two videos.

I won't watch these videos just as I don't watch trailers for movies I am eagerly awaiting. Feel free to comment though!
Anything else on the beta-tester front?

[Buster's Uncle]

We've got three people in the beta, and a secret Pandora forum with no action.  That's all I know.

[BlaneckW]

They probably realized they aren't sci-fi buffs.

[Geo]

They probably realized they aren't sci-fi buffs.

The three testers, or the game developers?