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Author Topic:   Did germany lose WW2 ??

Magnus posted 12-17-98 09:32 PM ET
The only countries that lend more money than they borrow today is: Germany and Japan.
The 2 allies in WW 2... So my question is: Did they really loose ww2?? (Italy changed side in the end...)
After the war they wasn�t allowed to build a strong army, and they recieved financial help from the whole world. This made them build up a great industry, and made them to the 2 biggest ecomomical superpowers in thw world today.
Hm. they might loose the war.. but apperantly they won in the end?

Gord McLeod posted 12-17-98 09:41 PM ET
BUT nobody's complaining about this particular "brand" of winning. I suspect the same would not have been said had the more obvious victory been achieved.
Aga1 posted 12-17-98 09:47 PM ET
Personaly i dont think ww2 was over untill 1989 i think of the cold war as a Cease Fire
SnowFire posted 12-17-98 10:49 PM ET
Except that Russia was an ally in WW2 and an enemy in the Cold War. So that doesn't' make much sense Aga1.
What, Magnus, do you have a problem with them being succesful? I should also remind you that Germany and Japan are two of our better allies. Either be nice to them and have them become your friends, or don't help them, leave them flopping in the dust, and have them grow back to hate you (Treaty of Versailles, and Germany's reaction to anyone?).
Mortis posted 12-18-98 01:46 AM ET
Because they declared war on Russia and the US.
Zan Thrax posted 12-18-98 02:39 AM ET
Do you think that the allies should have tried to crush their economy like after the first WW? I think everyone knows why that would have been really stupid.
Aga1 posted 12-18-98 04:44 PM ET
Russia Started off on the Axis side they attacked poland in the east in the second week of WW2.Then when hitler turned on them Britan wanted stalin to join there side since britan was fighting alone and then the USA came along
Yo_Yo_Yo_Hey posted 12-18-98 05:33 PM ET
If Germany never attacked Russia, do you think we(the allies) would of actually won it?? I doubt it. Germany had some of its best men, & generals commited on the east front. If those men were in France in 1944, I doubt we would have gotten too far off the beach. We barely got off the Normandy beaches as it is, after Monty was delayed in taking Caen, & our green troops were getting cut up in the hedgerows.
Your faithful & hell-bent NIMadier general,
YYYH
Utrecht posted 12-18-98 05:37 PM ET
Actually, Germany had sufficiently competnet generals on the western front. It was the fact that the German leader (fortunately) was a complete headcase and though that he could strategize better than his generals. Consequently, these generals could not pull the armored divisions that they had in resevere to contain (and most likely crush) the extremely fragile allied beachhead.
You could take it a bit farther and say that Germany doomed herself when Goering conviced Hitler that he could bomb the English into submission rather than allowing the army to invade.
Utrecht posted 12-18-98 05:38 PM ET
Also Magnus,
I believe that the Dutch (the only county to pay back her WW2 debts) and the Swiss also loan out more than they borrow.
Tom posted 12-18-98 11:31 PM ET
The German economy did have a revival in the post war years due to foreign investments. The good times continued until the end of the Cold War when large amounts of money had to be invested in former East Germany.
Today, German corporations are indeed among the "economic superpowers", but the average German faces high taxes and unemployment rates, benefitting little from the corporate wealth.
NOTE:
Finland also payed back all it's WWII debts!
PAX!
Yo_Yo_Yo_Hey posted 12-19-98 10:42 AM ET
I never said they didn't have competant generals, & other leaders, on the western front. I was saying his best generals were on the eastern front trying to kill the Russians, which they did a good job of. Russians were slughtered, fortunately their sheer numbers pushed the Germans back to Germany. If Hitler had moved his tank divisions from Calais to Normandy, would we have gotten anywhere??
Your faithful & hell-bent NIMadier general,
YYYH
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Author	Topic: Did germany lose WW2 ??
Magnus	posted 12-17-98 09:32 PM ET The only countries that lend more money than they borrow today is: Germany and Japan. The 2 allies in WW 2... So my question is: Did they really loose ww2?? (Italy changed side in the end...) After the war they wasn�t allowed to build a strong army, and they recieved financial help from the whole world. This made them build up a great industry, and made them to the 2 biggest ecomomical superpowers in thw world today. Hm. they might loose the war.. but apperantly they won in the end?
Gord McLeod	posted 12-17-98 09:41 PM ET BUT nobody's complaining about this particular "brand" of winning. I suspect the same would not have been said had the more obvious victory been achieved.
Aga1	posted 12-17-98 09:47 PM ET Personaly i dont think ww2 was over untill 1989 i think of the cold war as a Cease Fire
SnowFire	posted 12-17-98 10:49 PM ET Except that Russia was an ally in WW2 and an enemy in the Cold War. So that doesn't' make much sense Aga1. What, Magnus, do you have a problem with them being succesful? I should also remind you that Germany and Japan are two of our better allies. Either be nice to them and have them become your friends, or don't help them, leave them flopping in the dust, and have them grow back to hate you (Treaty of Versailles, and Germany's reaction to anyone?).
Mortis	posted 12-18-98 01:46 AM ET Because they declared war on Russia and the US.
Zan Thrax	posted 12-18-98 02:39 AM ET Do you think that the allies should have tried to crush their economy like after the first WW? I think everyone knows why that would have been really stupid.
Aga1	posted 12-18-98 04:44 PM ET Russia Started off on the Axis side they attacked poland in the east in the second week of WW2.Then when hitler turned on them Britan wanted stalin to join there side since britan was fighting alone and then the USA came along
Yo_Yo_Yo_Hey	posted 12-18-98 05:33 PM ET If Germany never attacked Russia, do you think we(the allies) would of actually won it?? I doubt it. Germany had some of its best men, & generals commited on the east front. If those men were in France in 1944, I doubt we would have gotten too far off the beach. We barely got off the Normandy beaches as it is, after Monty was delayed in taking Caen, & our green troops were getting cut up in the hedgerows. Your faithful & hell-bent NIMadier general, YYYH
Utrecht	posted 12-18-98 05:37 PM ET Actually, Germany had sufficiently competnet generals on the western front. It was the fact that the German leader (fortunately) was a complete headcase and though that he could strategize better than his generals. Consequently, these generals could not pull the armored divisions that they had in resevere to contain (and most likely crush) the extremely fragile allied beachhead. You could take it a bit farther and say that Germany doomed herself when Goering conviced Hitler that he could bomb the English into submission rather than allowing the army to invade.
Utrecht	posted 12-18-98 05:38 PM ET Also Magnus, I believe that the Dutch (the only county to pay back her WW2 debts) and the Swiss also loan out more than they borrow.
Tom	posted 12-18-98 11:31 PM ET The German economy did have a revival in the post war years due to foreign investments. The good times continued until the end of the Cold War when large amounts of money had to be invested in former East Germany. Today, German corporations are indeed among the "economic superpowers", but the average German faces high taxes and unemployment rates, benefitting little from the corporate wealth. NOTE: Finland also payed back all it's WWII debts! PAX!
Yo_Yo_Yo_Hey	posted 12-19-98 10:42 AM ET I never said they didn't have competant generals, & other leaders, on the western front. I was saying his best generals were on the eastern front trying to kill the Russians, which they did a good job of. Russians were slughtered, fortunately their sheer numbers pushed the Germans back to Germany. If Hitler had moved his tank divisions from Calais to Normandy, would we have gotten anywhere?? Your faithful & hell-bent NIMadier general, YYYH