Proselytizing units/ siphoning populations

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Author Topic:   Proselytizing units/ siphoning populations

Rang posted 12-03-98 06:32 PM ET
I'd like to see units with the special ability of siphoning off population from an enemy city and adding it to your own. The real world analogy would be missionaries/propaganda artists who go to an enemy city to convince its citizens to emmigrate to your cities.
Imran Siddiqui posted 12-03-98 06:41 PM ET
Rang, I like the immigration idea. It could really be a cool idea. Imagine getting an immigration spike and increasing you population by 2 in a turn!
Imran Siddiqui
Nobody
jsorense posted 12-03-98 06:58 PM ET
I have always assumed that The Lord's Believers armed with the Social Psychology base technology (after all Sister Miriam is a trained psychologist) would have the ability to convert units and bases rather than have to conquer them.
I hope & pray I am right.
jsorense
Bearer of the Faith, Defender of the Faithful, Avenger of Martyars
Talon posted 12-03-98 07:34 PM ET
I would also assume Yang would be able to convince some people to his side.
-Talon
"I refuse to go woth the flow"
Rang posted 12-03-98 08:43 PM ET
Jsorense, I'm not just talking about converting/bribing units and cities. I'm sure that'll prolly be a feature, since it was included in Civ. But I talking about immigration and siphoning populations from a single enemy city to a city of you control. This allows you to easily increase the population of one of your low pop cities, without risking military overexposure and headaches from bribing a new enemy city.
jsorense posted 12-03-98 09:37 PM ET
I get it now, Rang. Instead of, or in conjunction with, sending in a spy to steal technology you can send in a recruiter/public relations type dude to convince people to leave their hovels and hopeless lives in city A of Faction B and move to the land of opportunity where the streets are paved with gold in city D of Faction F.
I like your comments about overextended and overexposed. And it would be cheaper than bribery, too.
Would there be a percentage chance that the recruited population would be salted with spies, assassins, and saboteurs as they are in real life?
Rang posted 12-04-98 06:13 PM ET
That would be interesting, but those additional elements might make the game too complex. Also, I'm not sure how that would work. Spies, assassins, etc are usually units. But here, we're simply talking about changing the number representing population in a city.
In addition, using this feature would probably not elicit as much hostility form the enemy compared to bribing a city. The overextension of military is a real concern when you bribe a city. Sometimes, you just want the extra people, but not the city.
Octopus posted 12-05-98 12:22 AM ET
A way that this could be implemented is if there was a "refugee" unit that could be created. This would reduce the population of a city by 1, and when it reached another city, that city's population would increase by one. A propaganda type unit would have the ability to create these units from enemy cities. Also, if you ever raze a city, some of the population is converted into these refugee units. Naturally, killing the refugee units would be considered an atrocity. Combining this idea with Rang's "disguise" idea could allow for the spies, infiltrators, and sabateurs.
DCA posted 12-05-98 01:02 AM ET
Cool, I like it! But who would control the refugee unit?
I've always found the 'city bribing' concept rather silly (though it sure is effective in Civ). Immigration from propaganda sounds much better (though some governments would simply forbid their citizens from leaving).
DCA,
We have met the enemy and he is us.
Octopus posted 12-05-98 01:15 AM ET
"But who would control the refugee unit?"
Hmmm... Well, if there are unhappy citizens, then the refugee would be controlled by the faction that engaged in the propaganda, but the happiness of the city that just lost population would go up (all the whiners and complainers just packed up and left). If there aren't any unhappy citizens, then the refugees would be neutral (they'd wander around until they hit a city) but they'd be bribable just like any other unit. The original faction should probably get a discount if they want to try convince them to return to their home faction through bribery.
Or they could do something else.
DHE_X2 posted 12-05-98 03:36 AM ET
Sweet idea. How about a certain percentage chance that one unit of population was infiltrated w/ spies, etc and that once in your city they would do their damage and then flee, die, get caught, etc, so they couldn't be used again. Also, the pop could be screened by certain defences.
US Us us us, and THEM THEm THem Them
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Author	Topic: Proselytizing units/ siphoning populations
Rang	posted 12-03-98 06:32 PM ET I'd like to see units with the special ability of siphoning off population from an enemy city and adding it to your own. The real world analogy would be missionaries/propaganda artists who go to an enemy city to convince its citizens to emmigrate to your cities.
Imran Siddiqui	posted 12-03-98 06:41 PM ET Rang, I like the immigration idea. It could really be a cool idea. Imagine getting an immigration spike and increasing you population by 2 in a turn! Imran Siddiqui Nobody
jsorense	posted 12-03-98 06:58 PM ET I have always assumed that The Lord's Believers armed with the Social Psychology base technology (after all Sister Miriam is a trained psychologist) would have the ability to convert units and bases rather than have to conquer them. I hope & pray I am right. jsorense Bearer of the Faith, Defender of the Faithful, Avenger of Martyars
Talon	posted 12-03-98 07:34 PM ET I would also assume Yang would be able to convince some people to his side. -Talon "I refuse to go woth the flow"
Rang	posted 12-03-98 08:43 PM ET Jsorense, I'm not just talking about converting/bribing units and cities. I'm sure that'll prolly be a feature, since it was included in Civ. But I talking about immigration and siphoning populations from a single enemy city to a city of you control. This allows you to easily increase the population of one of your low pop cities, without risking military overexposure and headaches from bribing a new enemy city.
jsorense	posted 12-03-98 09:37 PM ET I get it now, Rang. Instead of, or in conjunction with, sending in a spy to steal technology you can send in a recruiter/public relations type dude to convince people to leave their hovels and hopeless lives in city A of Faction B and move to the land of opportunity where the streets are paved with gold in city D of Faction F. I like your comments about overextended and overexposed. And it would be cheaper than bribery, too. Would there be a percentage chance that the recruited population would be salted with spies, assassins, and saboteurs as they are in real life?
Rang	posted 12-04-98 06:13 PM ET That would be interesting, but those additional elements might make the game too complex. Also, I'm not sure how that would work. Spies, assassins, etc are usually units. But here, we're simply talking about changing the number representing population in a city. In addition, using this feature would probably not elicit as much hostility form the enemy compared to bribing a city. The overextension of military is a real concern when you bribe a city. Sometimes, you just want the extra people, but not the city.
Octopus	posted 12-05-98 12:22 AM ET A way that this could be implemented is if there was a "refugee" unit that could be created. This would reduce the population of a city by 1, and when it reached another city, that city's population would increase by one. A propaganda type unit would have the ability to create these units from enemy cities. Also, if you ever raze a city, some of the population is converted into these refugee units. Naturally, killing the refugee units would be considered an atrocity. Combining this idea with Rang's "disguise" idea could allow for the spies, infiltrators, and sabateurs.
DCA	posted 12-05-98 01:02 AM ET Cool, I like it! But who would control the refugee unit? I've always found the 'city bribing' concept rather silly (though it sure is effective in Civ). Immigration from propaganda sounds much better (though some governments would simply forbid their citizens from leaving). DCA, We have met the enemy and he is us.
Octopus	posted 12-05-98 01:15 AM ET "But who would control the refugee unit?" Hmmm... Well, if there are unhappy citizens, then the refugee would be controlled by the faction that engaged in the propaganda, but the happiness of the city that just lost population would go up (all the whiners and complainers just packed up and left). If there aren't any unhappy citizens, then the refugees would be neutral (they'd wander around until they hit a city) but they'd be bribable just like any other unit. The original faction should probably get a discount if they want to try convince them to return to their home faction through bribery. Or they could do something else.
DHE_X2	posted 12-05-98 03:36 AM ET Sweet idea. How about a certain percentage chance that one unit of population was infiltrated w/ spies, etc and that once in your city they would do their damage and then flee, die, get caught, etc, so they couldn't be used again. Also, the pop could be screened by certain defences. US Us us us, and THEM THEm THem Them