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Aviagion posted 05-04-99 05:43 PM ET
This is my first post to this board, and I was hoping someone could point me in the direction of some of the other Gaians out there.
Thanks,
Aviagion
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 09:52 PM ET
alot of people post of the other factions not the gaians usaully and its good to see that someone else likes them
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:01 PM ET
Still haven't tried the Gaians, but I would love to hear and respond to ideas for them. They are certainly a good faction, and since I'm a planet-ravaging Morganite at the moment I'd like to give them a try eventually to see what it's like using those worms rather than fighting them all game.
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:04 PM ET
I guess with Demo/Green you can get some amazing efficiency and you can also use the population boom trick with Demo/Planned/Creches with them. These 2 things alone make them a strong faction.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:07 PM ET
gaian warfare usally consists of mindworms so when fighting with them or against mindworms are great to use for guerilla warfare
seth5454
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:11 PM ET
My understanding is that captured mindworms still cost support when they don't end a turn in fungus. Is this true of bred mindworms as well? Also, how well do mindworms fare against factions with decent morale? Are they still effective?
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:18 PM ET
it really depends on the mindworms morale when fighting a reg. unit and every time u attack u get 3 psi atatack compared to the unit which will get 2 psi attack for defending and when u capture a mind worm the nearest base gets responsibility for it in and out of fungus i believe for bred and captured mindworms alike also the best S.E. choices with gaians seem to be police state green knowledge and the eudaimonic at least it works great for me
seth5454
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:24 PM ET
Seth-- But then you lose the real advantage of the gaians besides planet-- efficiency. With a high efficiency (with demo/green knowledge you get +7), you can expand endlessly and still benefit from distant bases. I know the efficiency is still +3 with the SE choices you pick, but I'd rather make the most of it. I guess the low support may be a problem for a little while but it can be overcome by a rapidly growing faction, and since you can get those early population booms you will expand quickly.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:31 PM ET
yes very good point but i always like to have a very sufficient military in democracy only allows u one that is very weak and your support lags from fighting.
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:32 PM ET
Anyone know any good places that provide strategies for using mindworms with the Gaians? Do any of you have some thoughts on this?
I think the Gaians have the potential to be one of the very best non-Free Market factions. The only thing I wonder is what good that +1 nutrients on fungus squares-- I know it can help you grow early if you are stuck in a starting area with very little rainy squares, but what else is it good for when forests and boreholes seem to work best for the rest of the game?
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:33 PM ET
Seth-- But as I said support isn't the biggest deal when your bases are large enough, and it is easy to make them large with population booms.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:34 PM ET
smeagol;
try the Strategys and Tactics section they always have some interesting ways to make the most of a faction
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:34 PM ET
Seth-- But Police State is a pretty good idea very early in the game if you want to wipe out some factions early. I just don't like it for later points in the game when efficiency is a real concern.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:36 PM ET
i know smeagol but big bases wont win a war if u have nothin but pathetic units supporting it and for me i dont know why but support always has to be above 0
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:40 PM ET
for me its later in the game when big wars start that police state is most needed to help defend and takeover a hostile faction
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:40 PM ET
Seth-- So I take it you don't use clean reactors? You should put probes on your city defenders so that they are no support, and also have the ability to probe.
As I just said though very early in the game police state can help, but in the long run democracy is the better choice.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:41 PM ET
u know something smeagol i completely forgot about clean reactors i never really used them in the game cause i always had +2 support
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:44 PM ET
u r right about another thing to efficiency is need later in the game higher the better but my tactics were to finish as fast as i can so thats y i never really used clean reactors
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:45 PM ET
Yeah, clean reactors make support worthless, but in many games much will be decided before they come around so you have to either grow quickly early (with pop booms) or boost that support. This is the main reason why conquerors do so much better in multiplayer, obviously. But against the computer things are a lot easier for the builder using democracy.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:47 PM ET
not necessarily conquerors dont always win but chances r they will
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:48 PM ET
so then i take it your not really into war
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:49 PM ET
Well, that's all I mean. I had a laugher of a game last night using Yang and nerve gas-- it's just way too easy to kill everybody with those X-Impact Rovers. And I was just using the nerve gas for fun-- I could easily have won without it.
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:51 PM ET
From my last message you should see that I am in fact quite into war. But I like to use free market if I can with the PKs or Morgan, and fight a war when I get clean reactors and punishment spheres-- build the sphere in a base and make my whole army there. No drones. And if I want with Morgan I can use Police State early and fight an early impact rover war and then go back to free market after.
But I look forward to trying the Gaians.
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:52 PM ET
smeagol when u play do u go through alphahq?and if u do is that the that u use
Smeagol posted 05-06-99 10:55 PM ET
I don't play multiplayer actually-- mostly because I don't even have the time to play an extensive single player game. I'm also not sure if my computer could handle multiplayer.
I'm assuming that you were in fact referring to mp games, right?
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:57 PM ET
yeah i know what u mean a mp game started that me and some others started over a month ago was just finished yesterday
seth5454 posted 05-06-99 10:59 PM ET
it ended at about 2401 i was the last faction to be taken out by some human player
Smeagol posted 05-07-99 12:08 AM ET
Ok, something that I don't like about the gaians-- you would think a faction so in tune with the planet would benefit more from fungus squares. But +1 nutrients isn't a big deal at all, and in the end the gaians benefit more from getting rid of the fungus and terraforming just like everyone else. Forest with tree farms and hybrid forests kills fungus with centauri ecology, meditation, and even with centauri genetics and psi. For forests you can also benefit from rivers to give 3/2/3 while fungus without genetics and psi gives (for gaians) 2/0/1 and with them gives 3/1/2. I think the gaians would be more fun to play if these benefits were better.
Earwicker posted 05-07-99 10:36 AM ET
Capturing a few mindworms very early in the game is the key to success when you're the Gaians:
* The morale penalty makes it tougher for your scouts to fend off worms off (even when you're attacking), so an early capture to defend those bases and escort colony pods at the beginning is a must.
* They move quickly through fungus to go pop-popping (and are usually left alone when other worms appear out of a pod).
* They are an excellent early attack unit to make your neighbors more neighborly (or to make them ex-neighbors).
The above apply similarly for IotD, maybe even a little more so. Nothing says "hello yang" better than an attack transport (except maybe a singularity PB).
If the game progresses to a point where enemy units have trance and more powerful reactors, worm warfare becomes less effective -- so better press your advantage early and don't let them get that strong.
Smeagol -- You're right about the fungus bonus not being that big a deal sa compared to 3-2-3 forests. But in the beginning the 2 food gives you some flexibility with base placement for the short term -- a base in an otherwise inhospitable location can grow while you're waiting for the formers to do their thing (particularly true for those size 3 PTS bases). I wish you the same success and fun I have with them. With their efficiency and military success (and thieving @#$ probes), I can have as large energy reserves as I get with my other faves Morgan and PK's.
Aviagion posted 05-07-99 11:20 AM ET
I think Earwicker's post basically sums up the way to play Gaia. The only thing I have to add is to go for the efficency with Demo/Green/Knowledge
Oh, and capture those mind worms near the beginning far from your bases... because you can get some fairly deadly free units that way.
And of course, always expand, expand and expand... Gaians are good at exploring and propogating.
G e o r g e r i f i c posted 05-08-99 01:54 AM ET
Smeagol,
I'm playing the Gaians, and the fungus squares I harvest give 3-3-3. I think one of the energy might be from my economy rating, but where is that other mineral or two coming from?
G e o r g e r i f i c posted 05-08-99 02:02 AM ET
Also, one of thre best things you can do early on with that midworm capture is send out 2-4 skimships ASAP. Have them start capturing Isles, and then spread these out, to capture more. You can get huge fleets of the things, often unsupported, and help yourself to free transports and most of the water UNITY pods. With this, I was able to link almost all my cities with artifacts.
Smeagol posted 05-09-99 05:12 PM ET
Georgerific-- How many techs have you discovered? The later techs boost output of fungus squares, but I don't think it can get to +3/square for minerals.
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Author	Topic: Gaian looking for other ecologists.
Aviagion	posted 05-04-99 05:43 PM ET This is my first post to this board, and I was hoping someone could point me in the direction of some of the other Gaians out there. Thanks, Aviagion
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 09:52 PM ET alot of people post of the other factions not the gaians usaully and its good to see that someone else likes them
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:01 PM ET Still haven't tried the Gaians, but I would love to hear and respond to ideas for them. They are certainly a good faction, and since I'm a planet-ravaging Morganite at the moment I'd like to give them a try eventually to see what it's like using those worms rather than fighting them all game.
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:04 PM ET I guess with Demo/Green you can get some amazing efficiency and you can also use the population boom trick with Demo/Planned/Creches with them. These 2 things alone make them a strong faction.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:07 PM ET gaian warfare usally consists of mindworms so when fighting with them or against mindworms are great to use for guerilla warfare seth5454
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:11 PM ET My understanding is that captured mindworms still cost support when they don't end a turn in fungus. Is this true of bred mindworms as well? Also, how well do mindworms fare against factions with decent morale? Are they still effective?
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:18 PM ET it really depends on the mindworms morale when fighting a reg. unit and every time u attack u get 3 psi atatack compared to the unit which will get 2 psi attack for defending and when u capture a mind worm the nearest base gets responsibility for it in and out of fungus i believe for bred and captured mindworms alike also the best S.E. choices with gaians seem to be police state green knowledge and the eudaimonic at least it works great for me seth5454
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:24 PM ET Seth-- But then you lose the real advantage of the gaians besides planet-- efficiency. With a high efficiency (with demo/green knowledge you get +7), you can expand endlessly and still benefit from distant bases. I know the efficiency is still +3 with the SE choices you pick, but I'd rather make the most of it. I guess the low support may be a problem for a little while but it can be overcome by a rapidly growing faction, and since you can get those early population booms you will expand quickly.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:31 PM ET yes very good point but i always like to have a very sufficient military in democracy only allows u one that is very weak and your support lags from fighting.
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:32 PM ET Anyone know any good places that provide strategies for using mindworms with the Gaians? Do any of you have some thoughts on this? I think the Gaians have the potential to be one of the very best non-Free Market factions. The only thing I wonder is what good that +1 nutrients on fungus squares-- I know it can help you grow early if you are stuck in a starting area with very little rainy squares, but what else is it good for when forests and boreholes seem to work best for the rest of the game?
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:33 PM ET Seth-- But as I said support isn't the biggest deal when your bases are large enough, and it is easy to make them large with population booms.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:34 PM ET smeagol; try the Strategys and Tactics section they always have some interesting ways to make the most of a faction
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:34 PM ET Seth-- But Police State is a pretty good idea very early in the game if you want to wipe out some factions early. I just don't like it for later points in the game when efficiency is a real concern.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:36 PM ET i know smeagol but big bases wont win a war if u have nothin but pathetic units supporting it and for me i dont know why but support always has to be above 0
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:40 PM ET for me its later in the game when big wars start that police state is most needed to help defend and takeover a hostile faction
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:40 PM ET Seth-- So I take it you don't use clean reactors? You should put probes on your city defenders so that they are no support, and also have the ability to probe. As I just said though very early in the game police state can help, but in the long run democracy is the better choice.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:41 PM ET u know something smeagol i completely forgot about clean reactors i never really used them in the game cause i always had +2 support
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:44 PM ET u r right about another thing to efficiency is need later in the game higher the better but my tactics were to finish as fast as i can so thats y i never really used clean reactors
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:45 PM ET Yeah, clean reactors make support worthless, but in many games much will be decided before they come around so you have to either grow quickly early (with pop booms) or boost that support. This is the main reason why conquerors do so much better in multiplayer, obviously. But against the computer things are a lot easier for the builder using democracy.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:47 PM ET not necessarily conquerors dont always win but chances r they will
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:48 PM ET so then i take it your not really into war
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:49 PM ET Well, that's all I mean. I had a laugher of a game last night using Yang and nerve gas-- it's just way too easy to kill everybody with those X-Impact Rovers. And I was just using the nerve gas for fun-- I could easily have won without it.
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:51 PM ET From my last message you should see that I am in fact quite into war. But I like to use free market if I can with the PKs or Morgan, and fight a war when I get clean reactors and punishment spheres-- build the sphere in a base and make my whole army there. No drones. And if I want with Morgan I can use Police State early and fight an early impact rover war and then go back to free market after. But I look forward to trying the Gaians.
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:52 PM ET smeagol when u play do u go through alphahq?and if u do is that the that u use
Smeagol	posted 05-06-99 10:55 PM ET I don't play multiplayer actually-- mostly because I don't even have the time to play an extensive single player game. I'm also not sure if my computer could handle multiplayer. I'm assuming that you were in fact referring to mp games, right?
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:57 PM ET yeah i know what u mean a mp game started that me and some others started over a month ago was just finished yesterday
seth5454	posted 05-06-99 10:59 PM ET it ended at about 2401 i was the last faction to be taken out by some human player
Smeagol	posted 05-07-99 12:08 AM ET Ok, something that I don't like about the gaians-- you would think a faction so in tune with the planet would benefit more from fungus squares. But +1 nutrients isn't a big deal at all, and in the end the gaians benefit more from getting rid of the fungus and terraforming just like everyone else. Forest with tree farms and hybrid forests kills fungus with centauri ecology, meditation, and even with centauri genetics and psi. For forests you can also benefit from rivers to give 3/2/3 while fungus without genetics and psi gives (for gaians) 2/0/1 and with them gives 3/1/2. I think the gaians would be more fun to play if these benefits were better.
Earwicker	posted 05-07-99 10:36 AM ET Capturing a few mindworms very early in the game is the key to success when you're the Gaians: * The morale penalty makes it tougher for your scouts to fend off worms off (even when you're attacking), so an early capture to defend those bases and escort colony pods at the beginning is a must. * They move quickly through fungus to go pop-popping (and are usually left alone when other worms appear out of a pod). * They are an excellent early attack unit to make your neighbors more neighborly (or to make them ex-neighbors). The above apply similarly for IotD, maybe even a little more so. Nothing says "hello yang" better than an attack transport (except maybe a singularity PB). If the game progresses to a point where enemy units have trance and more powerful reactors, worm warfare becomes less effective -- so better press your advantage early and don't let them get that strong. Smeagol -- You're right about the fungus bonus not being that big a deal sa compared to 3-2-3 forests. But in the beginning the 2 food gives you some flexibility with base placement for the short term -- a base in an otherwise inhospitable location can grow while you're waiting for the formers to do their thing (particularly true for those size 3 PTS bases). I wish you the same success and fun I have with them. With their efficiency and military success (and thieving @#$ probes), I can have as large energy reserves as I get with my other faves Morgan and PK's.
Aviagion	posted 05-07-99 11:20 AM ET I think Earwicker's post basically sums up the way to play Gaia. The only thing I have to add is to go for the efficency with Demo/Green/Knowledge Oh, and capture those mind worms near the beginning far from your bases... because you can get some fairly deadly free units that way. And of course, always expand, expand and expand... Gaians are good at exploring and propogating.
G e o r g e r i f i c	posted 05-08-99 01:54 AM ET Smeagol, I'm playing the Gaians, and the fungus squares I harvest give 3-3-3. I think one of the energy might be from my economy rating, but where is that other mineral or two coming from?
G e o r g e r i f i c	posted 05-08-99 02:02 AM ET Also, one of thre best things you can do early on with that midworm capture is send out 2-4 skimships ASAP. Have them start capturing Isles, and then spread these out, to capture more. You can get huge fleets of the things, often unsupported, and help yourself to free transports and most of the water UNITY pods. With this, I was able to link almost all my cities with artifacts.
Smeagol	posted 05-09-99 05:12 PM ET Georgerific-- How many techs have you discovered? The later techs boost output of fungus squares, but I don't think it can get to +3/square for minerals.