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Author Topic:   The Mineral Paradigm

jhankla posted 05-13-99 06:58 PM ET
Here is some ways I increase the production and phych of my cities using a technique I stumbled upon.

Get neural grafting and clean reactors as soon as you can, here's why:

The key to keeping your people happy in time of war, with a large army is to make all your units use clean reactors. Not having to support units means they don't care how many they build or how many are out there. Include your garrisons in this also, it seems to help the drone situation more than police benefits.
Create a former that has double the terriform time, but don't worry about removing fungus faster. Eventually you'll want all the fungus you can get and removing it faster is a waste. Make them double speed and CLEAN REACTORS so they don't count in you support column.
Do this and you'll be supprised to find you have a vast amount of extra resources at a time you need them the most! It's worth about a 1000 energy to convert all your units to clean reactors FAST as you can and will pay back massive dividends. Especially changing your formers over to clean ones as most land and sea bases have two and coastal cities FOUR! That's an average of two to three windfall resources per city instantly in a single round, a vast difference in your prospects instantly!
S_Carton_Esq posted 05-13-99 07:26 PM ET
Unfortunately, the clean reactor ability only refers to mineral support. It has no effect upon drone generation under low police value situations (such as free market). So, clean reactor units will still cause extra drones to be created when stationed outside of your territory under a free market economy. You make a good point about making clean super formers, but I would like to add one refinement. In addition to the army of clean, super formers, have 2 or 3 super, fungicidal formers, and devote them exclusively to clearing fungus. One super, fungicidal former can clear fungus in 2 turns (1 turn if you have the Xenoempathy dome), so you will very quickly get rid of all the of the land fungus within your territory that way. Once all of the fungus is gone, upgrade the super, fungicidal formers to clean, super formers and you are all set.
eNo posted 05-14-99 08:43 PM ET
Also try to make the super fungicidal formers on a gravship. This way it can clear both types of fungus.
High Priest posted 05-14-99 09:17 PM ET
Question:
"Eventually you'll want all the fungus you can get and removing it faster is a waste."
I guess you're referring to the Gaians, or I guess I don't know what you mean. Could I be missing out on something, 'cus in my book the less fungus the better.
(Guess if you have Xeno-Dome and Pholus Mutagen it would be great as a natural barrier)
High Priest
Urban Ranger posted 05-15-99 12:42 PM ET
Eventually you can get 2-3-3 from fungus squares. But that's very, very, late in the game. For Gaians it'll be 3-3-3.
Urban Ranger posted 05-15-99 12:47 PM ET
After Centauri Psi though, you don't need to clean fungus before you plant forest, which is what I assume you will do for most of the sqaures. Forest squares are very good once you can build Tree Farms and Hybrid Forests. It is the most cost effective way to terraform. If you want a borehole or something else, then you can terraform after you plant the forest. You lose a turn but gain 5 minerals for cutting down the trees.
eNo posted 05-15-99 03:22 PM ET
Thats 5 energy not minerals.
Al Gore Rythm posted 05-15-99 03:24 PM ET
eNo:
Nope. When you cut down a forest the nearest city gets five MINERALS to its current production.
Valtyr posted 05-15-99 05:48 PM ET
Late in the game I plant fungus almost everywhere, playing as the Gaians of course.
High Priest posted 05-15-99 06:42 PM ET
Hmmm...
Guess thats why its rarely very profitable for me. Still seems a better idea(even if Gaians) to plant forests and build improvements around your cities(can't get improvements on fungus). Also won't work if you're in Free Market.
Best just to improve terrain to begin with, then use fungus(don't plant it) and improved squares. Of course, you might not want worms to have direct acces to your base, either.
High Priest
still not convinced
eNo posted 05-15-99 08:34 PM ET
Sorry. My mistake. So basically one can use a Super Former to increase mineral production? Just keep on switching between Plant Forest and Destroy Enhancement?
Plato90s posted 05-15-99 09:05 PM ET
I suppose. With Weather Paradigm and Super Former, forest planting can be done in a single turn by 2 SuperFormers. And you can plant fungus with another 2 formers in a single turn.
Using 4 SuperFormers, you can cycle from forest to fungus and back to forest in a single turn. But is it worthwhile to get 5 minerals by using 4 SuperFormers and your time managing them?
eNo posted 05-15-99 10:27 PM ET
I guess it depends of if your going for a highscore. I'm playing a game where I micromanage everything and I'm pretty big. I only play about 5 turns a time.
K posted 05-16-99 01:47 AM ET
The idea is avlid, and the problem of having extra drons being created by military units outside of a city, well what you you is crete a "punishment city" that supports ALL your clean units, and so you get no extra drones.
eNo posted 05-16-99 01:31 PM ET
Formers create drones? I thought only combat units did so.
googlie posted 05-17-99 08:04 PM ET
eNo: Right on (alternating strategy). In my current One City Challenge game I' on an island that I terraformed to the max with 4 formers (built during a period when I had nothing left to build) Forest squares weren't being utilized by my city (waiting for the Hab Complex) so I had all four formers build farm/plant forest/build farm etc. Got 5 extra minerals every 2 turns, which helped when I was building prototypes. (One of the OCC rules is that offensive units can only be prototypes)
Even after my city grew, I repeated the tactic on squares outside my city radius - still got the 5 minerals per 2 turns (come to think of it, if I had built 16 formers I could have gotten 10 minerals per turn - but I guess I would be spending 16 per turn for upkeep, unless they were clean. Almost as good a tactic as crawlers!)
googlie posted 05-17-99 08:07 PM ET
Hey - where's the edit post feature in this forum? Just reread the last few posts and see that Plato90s has already covered that tactic. It does work even better with superformers.
Michael Kelly posted 05-18-99 05:17 PM ET
btw just how do you get that 3-3-3 on fungus? I'm with Gaians and at centuri psi but the fungus is only making 3-1-2 what are all the techs to get further? I know secrets of AC but what else?
jhankla posted 05-18-99 05:49 PM ET
Nice advice people!
I usually play green economy so I don't clean fungus, I eat it. That's why I wish I could set them all to planting it because past the mid point in the game it gives me more food, minerals and evergy than anything but an extra resource square or a borehole!
As for police and drone problems, that seems to only happen to me when I'm supporting them and a shield is showing, I've got one city with nine units out and it's got one drone... make that none if I trancend one.
Were got into a problem I just wrote a topic on. I think my system allows me to do this and yours may not.
jhankla posted 05-18-99 05:52 PM ET
Gaians or not, it doesn't matter as long as your Social Engineering is
Democratic, Green, Knowledge and eventually
Cybernetic you reap the benifits of fungus as 3-3-3 on my machine... I make that last point very clear the game is acting differntly on different systems!
jhankla posted 05-18-99 05:57 PM ET
Another device dependant glitch, here's what I'm seeing:
1. The amount of drones a city creates due to anything is so dependant on so many factors that you just can't figure it out.
2. Formers out of their cities territories don't cause drones on my home machine but when I enter the same game on my office machine THEY DO! Go figure that one Fraxis!
3. I'm going to stop giving advice about specific things, they may work for my machine on one game but not on another for another game. So, how can I give advice? I'll have half of you thinking I'm on drugs and the other half saying you can, but it works different!
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Author	Topic: The Mineral Paradigm
jhankla	posted 05-13-99 06:58 PM ET Here is some ways I increase the production and phych of my cities using a technique I stumbled upon. Get neural grafting and clean reactors as soon as you can, here's why: The key to keeping your people happy in time of war, with a large army is to make all your units use clean reactors. Not having to support units means they don't care how many they build or how many are out there. Include your garrisons in this also, it seems to help the drone situation more than police benefits. Create a former that has double the terriform time, but don't worry about removing fungus faster. Eventually you'll want all the fungus you can get and removing it faster is a waste. Make them double speed and CLEAN REACTORS so they don't count in you support column. Do this and you'll be supprised to find you have a vast amount of extra resources at a time you need them the most! It's worth about a 1000 energy to convert all your units to clean reactors FAST as you can and will pay back massive dividends. Especially changing your formers over to clean ones as most land and sea bases have two and coastal cities FOUR! That's an average of two to three windfall resources per city instantly in a single round, a vast difference in your prospects instantly!
S_Carton_Esq	posted 05-13-99 07:26 PM ET Unfortunately, the clean reactor ability only refers to mineral support. It has no effect upon drone generation under low police value situations (such as free market). So, clean reactor units will still cause extra drones to be created when stationed outside of your territory under a free market economy. You make a good point about making clean super formers, but I would like to add one refinement. In addition to the army of clean, super formers, have 2 or 3 super, fungicidal formers, and devote them exclusively to clearing fungus. One super, fungicidal former can clear fungus in 2 turns (1 turn if you have the Xenoempathy dome), so you will very quickly get rid of all the of the land fungus within your territory that way. Once all of the fungus is gone, upgrade the super, fungicidal formers to clean, super formers and you are all set.
eNo	posted 05-14-99 08:43 PM ET Also try to make the super fungicidal formers on a gravship. This way it can clear both types of fungus.
High Priest	posted 05-14-99 09:17 PM ET Question: "Eventually you'll want all the fungus you can get and removing it faster is a waste." I guess you're referring to the Gaians, or I guess I don't know what you mean. Could I be missing out on something, 'cus in my book the less fungus the better. (Guess if you have Xeno-Dome and Pholus Mutagen it would be great as a natural barrier) High Priest
Urban Ranger	posted 05-15-99 12:42 PM ET Eventually you can get 2-3-3 from fungus squares. But that's very, very, late in the game. For Gaians it'll be 3-3-3.
Urban Ranger	posted 05-15-99 12:47 PM ET After Centauri Psi though, you don't need to clean fungus before you plant forest, which is what I assume you will do for most of the sqaures. Forest squares are very good once you can build Tree Farms and Hybrid Forests. It is the most cost effective way to terraform. If you want a borehole or something else, then you can terraform after you plant the forest. You lose a turn but gain 5 minerals for cutting down the trees.
eNo	posted 05-15-99 03:22 PM ET Thats 5 energy not minerals.
Al Gore Rythm	posted 05-15-99 03:24 PM ET eNo: Nope. When you cut down a forest the nearest city gets five MINERALS to its current production.
Valtyr	posted 05-15-99 05:48 PM ET Late in the game I plant fungus almost everywhere, playing as the Gaians of course.
High Priest	posted 05-15-99 06:42 PM ET Hmmm... Guess thats why its rarely very profitable for me. Still seems a better idea(even if Gaians) to plant forests and build improvements around your cities(can't get improvements on fungus). Also won't work if you're in Free Market. Best just to improve terrain to begin with, then use fungus(don't plant it) and improved squares. Of course, you might not want worms to have direct acces to your base, either. High Priest still not convinced
eNo	posted 05-15-99 08:34 PM ET Sorry. My mistake. So basically one can use a Super Former to increase mineral production? Just keep on switching between Plant Forest and Destroy Enhancement?
Plato90s	posted 05-15-99 09:05 PM ET I suppose. With Weather Paradigm and Super Former, forest planting can be done in a single turn by 2 SuperFormers. And you can plant fungus with another 2 formers in a single turn. Using 4 SuperFormers, you can cycle from forest to fungus and back to forest in a single turn. But is it worthwhile to get 5 minerals by using 4 SuperFormers and your time managing them?
eNo	posted 05-15-99 10:27 PM ET I guess it depends of if your going for a highscore. I'm playing a game where I micromanage everything and I'm pretty big. I only play about 5 turns a time.
K	posted 05-16-99 01:47 AM ET The idea is avlid, and the problem of having extra drons being created by military units outside of a city, well what you you is crete a "punishment city" that supports ALL your clean units, and so you get no extra drones.
eNo	posted 05-16-99 01:31 PM ET Formers create drones? I thought only combat units did so.
googlie	posted 05-17-99 08:04 PM ET eNo: Right on (alternating strategy). In my current One City Challenge game I' on an island that I terraformed to the max with 4 formers (built during a period when I had nothing left to build) Forest squares weren't being utilized by my city (waiting for the Hab Complex) so I had all four formers build farm/plant forest/build farm etc. Got 5 extra minerals every 2 turns, which helped when I was building prototypes. (One of the OCC rules is that offensive units can only be prototypes) Even after my city grew, I repeated the tactic on squares outside my city radius - still got the 5 minerals per 2 turns (come to think of it, if I had built 16 formers I could have gotten 10 minerals per turn - but I guess I would be spending 16 per turn for upkeep, unless they were clean. Almost as good a tactic as crawlers!)
googlie	posted 05-17-99 08:07 PM ET Hey - where's the edit post feature in this forum? Just reread the last few posts and see that Plato90s has already covered that tactic. It does work even better with superformers.
Michael Kelly	posted 05-18-99 05:17 PM ET btw just how do you get that 3-3-3 on fungus? I'm with Gaians and at centuri psi but the fungus is only making 3-1-2 what are all the techs to get further? I know secrets of AC but what else?
jhankla	posted 05-18-99 05:49 PM ET Nice advice people! I usually play green economy so I don't clean fungus, I eat it. That's why I wish I could set them all to planting it because past the mid point in the game it gives me more food, minerals and evergy than anything but an extra resource square or a borehole! As for police and drone problems, that seems to only happen to me when I'm supporting them and a shield is showing, I've got one city with nine units out and it's got one drone... make that none if I trancend one. Were got into a problem I just wrote a topic on. I think my system allows me to do this and yours may not.
jhankla	posted 05-18-99 05:52 PM ET Gaians or not, it doesn't matter as long as your Social Engineering is Democratic, Green, Knowledge and eventually Cybernetic you reap the benifits of fungus as 3-3-3 on my machine... I make that last point very clear the game is acting differntly on different systems!
jhankla	posted 05-18-99 05:57 PM ET Another device dependant glitch, here's what I'm seeing: 1. The amount of drones a city creates due to anything is so dependant on so many factors that you just can't figure it out. 2. Formers out of their cities territories don't cause drones on my home machine but when I enter the same game on my office machine THEY DO! Go figure that one Fraxis! 3. I'm going to stop giving advice about specific things, they may work for my machine on one game but not on another for another game. So, how can I give advice? I'll have half of you thinking I'm on drugs and the other half saying you can, but it works different!