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Author Topic:   Gravships vs cruisers
ApcJK posted 04-20-99 12:31 PM ET   Click Here to See the Profile for ApcJK   Click Here to Email ApcJK  
Do you guys use cruisers any more when you get gravships?
Plato90s posted 04-20-99 12:35 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Plato90s    
Sure.

A heavily armed cruiser is cheaper to make than a gravship. Also, chances are you have leftover cruisers from previous wars, so why not use them? If nothing else, cruiser probe teams are among the best deals you can build.

Consider that a SubAAA Singularity Stasis Cruiser costs only ~120 minerals to make, while a Singularity Stasis Gravship would be on the order of 300 credits to make. If you are going to be attacking a lot of sea bases, the cruisers make sense. If you only have to take out 2-3, it's faster to build the Gravship than to wait for the cruisers to get there from your homebase.

THavoc posted 04-20-99 06:59 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for THavoc    
I'm not a big fan of the cruisers once I've achieved Grav technology. It may be cheaper to build the cruisers, but the added flexibility I have with the Gravs more than makes up the difference. About the only thing I can't do w/ the Gravs is destroy a base with the 'B' command...
PrinceBimz posted 04-20-99 11:49 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for PrinceBimz    
I prefer Cruisers. They are cheaper and you can probably build 2 Cruisers for the same cost of 1 Gravship. Remember a Gravship is an air unit, so SAM and AAA units can shoot them down. Also sometimes I find bombardment very necessary. Cruisers also serve well as escorts for my Transports.
Plato90s posted 04-21-99 12:56 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Plato90s    
Cruiser attacks do have some advantages compared to Gravships.

First, as has been pointed out, cruisers don't have a special vulnerability like Gravships do. Gravships can be attacked with air superiority units and let the attacker take a 100% bonus.

Second, there are fewer defensive bonuses applicable against cruisers.

Aerospace Complex gives defenders 100% bonus. AAA tracking gives another 100%. And in a worst case scenario, Tachyon Field adds another 100%. That means a defending unit may be invulnerable to any air attack.

Against a cruiser attack, the only possible bonus is the Tachyong field.

Even if you get Blink Displacer, the 100% bonus from AAA tracking still applies.

Finally, with the Maritime Control Center and Cyborg Factory, you can build/repair cruiser anywhere you want. To build Gravships, you need to make sure you have an Aerospace Complex or you'd end up making a wimpy gravship.

I agree Gravship is indeed the most flexible option, but if you are going to be waging a serious naval campaign [15+ objectives to be taken], you want to go with cruisers. I've fought wars before where I had squads of 6-8 cruisers operating in a single theatre taking city after city. Building the same force with Gravships would have taken twice as long.

The Panther posted 04-21-99 08:21 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for The Panther  Click Here to Email The Panther     
Once I get the Gravships, it's almost the only I build. They are really heavy. Ten can wipe an entire faction out (try and do that with cruisers!!)
Ken Yoon posted 04-21-99 01:30 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Ken Yoon  Click Here to Email Ken Yoon     
The idea of a bunch of cruisers to me is useless. All you need is one. The best thing about cruisers, to me, is that (like ground units) they can keep moving after taking a base. Gravships can't.

Thus, you can have a cruiser take over two (or more if they're really close together)bases a turn where a gravship could only take one.

Plato90s posted 04-21-99 02:00 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Plato90s    
There is a problem with singleton cruiser or Gravships. The AI can often build another defensive unit right after you destroy the current defending one. You'll end up takin 2-3 turns to capture a single city, whereas if you had even 2 cruisers, you'd take it in a single turn.

A flotille of multiple cruisers can spread out and take on weakly defended cities individually or congregate to take out a big base with 5-6 defenders. You also need to screen your cruisers from enemy cruisers, similar to how Gravships must be covered against enemy counterattacks.

I think people would be less enthusiastic about Gravships if they ever fought a war in which all sides had similar tech. I've lost Singularity Stasis Gravships to Shard interceptors before, but that Shard Interceptor would not dare to take on the cruisers with AAA.

MasterSmiloid posted 04-21-99 05:43 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for MasterSmiloid  Click Here to Email MasterSmiloid     
Hey, under the circumstances I'd go for a mix of cruiser AND gravships. Cruisers can bombard bases while the gravship get ready to kill your base AND the units defending it who are at roughly 50% health. BIG BONUS.

Also don't forget Cruiser carriers /w runways and repair bays. Makes sense, a well balanced fleet. You can never go wrong with some compromizes.

Plato90s posted 04-21-99 06:20 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Plato90s    
Very true.

Carriers do make good support units, especially when operating a large number of aircraft.

In addition, you can cover Gravships against air attacks by stacking a AAA cruiser on top of it.

Finally, carrier units allow you to carry what is arguably the best combat unit into action, the 'Copter.

Spig posted 04-22-99 11:21 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Spig  Click Here to Email Spig     
A mixed force of cruisers, needlejets, and gravships is best. I haven't had much chance to experiment (I've usually wiped the board by then) but I've found this works quite well.
ApcJK posted 04-22-99 12:27 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for ApcJK  Click Here to Email ApcJK     
Ok... I got more replies than I expected, but let me ask another question:
Do you use cruiser formers anymore when you can build gravship formers? They can be equally expensive to build.
jhankla posted 04-26-99 09:25 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for jhankla  Click Here to Email jhankla     
Apples and Oranges... Cruisers have their place, especially once carrier decks and repair bays come into play. Drag 50 cheep needlejets onto the enemy coast. Support it by placing a HEAVLY armed and armored gravship overhead as designated defender and you offense is almost invulnerable. The cheep aircraft you have outfitted with psi. ZAP... Works great against low psi troops like Yangbangers or Biblethumpers.

Another good use for gravships is if your caught with the beanstalk (Space Elevator) you put colony pods on the basic gravship design and pop them onto EVERY unused island on the map... Have all your cities make 5! 5 moves later your a super power!

Cruisers early in the game invested with TRANCE and other PSI upgrades make the best POD POACHERS next to Isles, if you ain't planet friendly. Then again when your pod popping the best strategy is the CTL-S keys just before you step on it! OOPS! SOrry, go back to sleep "Lifeforms!" (CTL-L, try again!)

Corvus Corax posted 04-30-99 12:11 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Corvus Corax  Click Here to Email Corvus Corax     
ApcJK: IMHO, gravship formers are about the only way to fight Planet in the endgame. Take a fungicide/super gravship former, add the-two-terraforming-and-fungus-busting-improving-projects-the-name-of-which-I-can't-recall-right-now, and you have a lean, mean land-raising & fungus-clearing machine (1 turn per square!) that can go basically anywhere in no time. Really helpful after the 'Voice of the Plant' has been built... Basically, as soon as I have the gravship tech, I scrap all my sea formers to build gravship formers instead. BTW, cruiser formers - what gives? They are a good deal more expensive than hydrofoil formers, yet their only advantage is they have another movement point? Never built on of them. Prolly never will.
Plato90s posted 04-30-99 03:06 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Plato90s    
Actually, cruiser formers have 2 movement points over Foils. And cruiser formers are just as cheap as Foil formers once you have Fusion power.

However, Gravship formers have a big disadvantage which precludes their exclusive use. Gravship formers can't take advantage of Mag-Rails. So I still keep a much larger stock of Hover Formers around.

Vinny posted 04-30-99 08:12 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Vinny  Click Here to Email Vinny     
Does anybody else notice this? You never get automatic prototypes of grvaships like everything else. I have also never seen an AI gravship.
StargazerBC posted 05-01-99 03:49 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for StargazerBC    
Probably because AI haven't research the tech's for grav-ship yet. I find the locust of chiron much more effective, esp. since you can get them 3x earlier than a gravship. They can take over cities too? Not sure of this.

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