Serious SMAC Bug Found at this late date

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Author Topic:   Serious SMAC Bug Found at this late date

tfs99 posted 06-04-99 02:45 PM ET
For those of you who don't make it over to the Support and Troubleshooting Forum, here is a tidbit about Transcend difficulty. Thanks to VictorK for finding and profiling this one:
It turns out that Energy maintenance costs are highly reduced on the two highest difficulty levels. Reduced by 66% at Transcend and 33% at Thinker.
Was this posted by someone else previously? I've been looking here pretty consistently since March and I can't recall ever seeing this one.
Any comments on how you think this affects gameplay?
Any comments on whether this one will be fixed in patch 4.0?
SMAC n ... Ted S.
DeVore posted 06-04-99 05:26 PM ET
Yep it probably makes Librarian the hardest level......
/Dev
MichaeltheGreat posted 06-04-99 05:31 PM ET
Overall, base maintenance costs are a minor issue, and the AI gets real production bonuses - I haven't checked my TI games where I'm governor to see if the same discounting happens to the AI factions, but the slower rate of research, better handicap to the AI on research and production, increased drone levels, etc. are far more of an issue than piddly base costs, and I'm a builder first, a conqueror in the middle and a transcend at the end player, so I think a straight conquest type player who is mostly crankin' out combat units would notice the difference even less.
It ought to be fixed, but it is no big deal - certainly not enough to make other levels easier or affect play balance in a big way.
The reason it probably hasn't been documented before is that it is no big deal.
Nell_Smith posted 06-04-99 05:39 PM ET
I wonder whether this is a bug at all, or whether it's an attempt to compensate for the AI's massive production cheats at the higher levels? I haven't bothered to count the boxes, but the AI seems to need about half the resources of the human player to build units, base facilities, SPs etc. And don't even get me started on the AI's happiness cheats... how many times have I peered inside my allies' bases, to find 50% drones, no talents and no riots whatseover?
Actually I hadn't noticed the reduced energy costs on the higher levels, but I, not being as mighty a player as some but still (IMHO) pretty good, find that I still lose the odd game at Transcend level, so I for one am not too unhappy about being given a break in terms of maintenance costs!
Nell... still sulking coz Lal Of The Silly Hat built the HSA before me in my current game, despite my fleets of resource convoys...
Nell_Smith posted 06-04-99 05:41 PM ET
PS: Maybe this is why people like playing as Morgan on the higher levels?? I played Morgan a couple of times on the lower levels, hated him, and so never bothered with him on Transcend level. But with those reduced maintenance costs, he must end up absolutely rolling in credits!! Perhaps I should give him a chance...?
marc420w posted 06-04-99 05:41 PM ET
They seemed to be attempting to make the energy/maintenence costs of buildings change with difficulty level. I wonder if the bug is that they went the wrong way.
Maybe they meant to have maintenence costs <b>increase</b> by 66% on Transcend levels!
So far, in this game, energy(money) shortages never bothered me much. Back in Civ and CivII it was possible to build city improvements too quickly, or if you didn't get out of Monarchy, either way you'd find your maintenence costs eating up all of your money and your research very slow. Don't seem to hit that in SMAC though.
Darkstar posted 06-04-99 05:54 PM ET
I doubt it was meant as an aid. It was either 1) meant for citizen/talent and had the wrong constant/number put into the formula (meaning a 66% bonus reduction to Citezen/33% talent) or 2) someone put a minus instead of a plus (or visa versa, depending on the formula). Considering SMAC's overall QA testing level seems to be low, I am not surprised at its existance.
-Darkstar
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Author	Topic: Serious SMAC Bug Found at this late date
tfs99	posted 06-04-99 02:45 PM ET For those of you who don't make it over to the Support and Troubleshooting Forum, here is a tidbit about Transcend difficulty. Thanks to VictorK for finding and profiling this one: It turns out that Energy maintenance costs are highly reduced on the two highest difficulty levels. Reduced by 66% at Transcend and 33% at Thinker. Was this posted by someone else previously? I've been looking here pretty consistently since March and I can't recall ever seeing this one. Any comments on how you think this affects gameplay? Any comments on whether this one will be fixed in patch 4.0? SMAC n ... Ted S.
DeVore	posted 06-04-99 05:26 PM ET Yep it probably makes Librarian the hardest level...... /Dev
MichaeltheGreat	posted 06-04-99 05:31 PM ET Overall, base maintenance costs are a minor issue, and the AI gets real production bonuses - I haven't checked my TI games where I'm governor to see if the same discounting happens to the AI factions, but the slower rate of research, better handicap to the AI on research and production, increased drone levels, etc. are far more of an issue than piddly base costs, and I'm a builder first, a conqueror in the middle and a transcend at the end player, so I think a straight conquest type player who is mostly crankin' out combat units would notice the difference even less. It ought to be fixed, but it is no big deal - certainly not enough to make other levels easier or affect play balance in a big way. The reason it probably hasn't been documented before is that it is no big deal.
Nell_Smith	posted 06-04-99 05:39 PM ET I wonder whether this is a bug at all, or whether it's an attempt to compensate for the AI's massive production cheats at the higher levels? I haven't bothered to count the boxes, but the AI seems to need about half the resources of the human player to build units, base facilities, SPs etc. And don't even get me started on the AI's happiness cheats... how many times have I peered inside my allies' bases, to find 50% drones, no talents and no riots whatseover? Actually I hadn't noticed the reduced energy costs on the higher levels, but I, not being as mighty a player as some but still (IMHO) pretty good, find that I still lose the odd game at Transcend level, so I for one am not too unhappy about being given a break in terms of maintenance costs! Nell... still sulking coz Lal Of The Silly Hat built the HSA before me in my current game, despite my fleets of resource convoys...
Nell_Smith	posted 06-04-99 05:41 PM ET PS: Maybe this is why people like playing as Morgan on the higher levels?? I played Morgan a couple of times on the lower levels, hated him, and so never bothered with him on Transcend level. But with those reduced maintenance costs, he must end up absolutely rolling in credits!! Perhaps I should give him a chance...?
marc420w	posted 06-04-99 05:41 PM ET They seemed to be attempting to make the energy/maintenence costs of buildings change with difficulty level. I wonder if the bug is that they went the wrong way. Maybe they meant to have maintenence costs <b>increase</b> by 66% on Transcend levels! So far, in this game, energy(money) shortages never bothered me much. Back in Civ and CivII it was possible to build city improvements too quickly, or if you didn't get out of Monarchy, either way you'd find your maintenence costs eating up all of your money and your research very slow. Don't seem to hit that in SMAC though.
Darkstar	posted 06-04-99 05:54 PM ET I doubt it was meant as an aid. It was either 1) meant for citizen/talent and had the wrong constant/number put into the formula (meaning a 66% bonus reduction to Citezen/33% talent) or 2) someone put a minus instead of a plus (or visa versa, depending on the formula). Considering SMAC's overall QA testing level seems to be low, I am not surprised at its existance. -Darkstar