Who are more Liberal, British or American?

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Author Topic:   Who are more Liberal, British or American?

God Emperor Eccles V posted 05-21-99 07:31 PM ET
read the title.
A lot of British people seem more tolerant of homosexuals.
Also British politics seems a bit more Left than in the US. (Thatcher was an accident, lets not start on the sacred cow)
Also British People broke from the Tyranny of the church much earlier than in the US.
Remember the Salem Theocracy(not CTP!)
Also Prohibition, that was religion crazed, you had you uptight nuts up until a much later time than us.
Yes I am British (not English).
Discuss
President Korian posted 05-21-99 08:22 PM ET
British, by far.
Frodo83 posted 05-21-99 09:13 PM ET
I think that to accurately judge which country is more liberal, one must have lived in both countries for a signifigant amount of time and not rely on past events as a factor. And Mr. President, please explain your reasoning behind your statement.
God Emperor Eccles V posted 05-22-99 05:56 AM ET
I've been in both
Hugo Rune posted 05-22-99 07:03 AM ET
You have to realise the difference in the meaning of the world "liberal" in these two countries to fully comprehend this issue. In the United States, "Liberal" means someone on the left wing of politics, advocating radical change in society. This is not the case in the UK at all. There, a "liberal" is someone quite at the middle of the political spectrum, not quite a conservative but nothing like a real Socialist Either. Most people on the left wing of british politics would scoff if someone called them "liberal". If you look at the americans, on the other hand, Some of your more "liberal" politicians would probably be called "social democrat" if they lived in the UK.
Here in sweden, It's even worse. All of our "conservative" parties are actually liberal, quite on par with the democratic party in the US. Then we have socialists and, even worse in the Eyes of americans, Communists. Now, the Socialists and communists are the Feminists, Gay Rights Activists, etc. here in sweden.
Kefaed posted 05-22-99 01:38 PM ET
Yeah, the British are way more to the left on the political spectrum than the U.S. is. However, since they are the most conservative(in U.S. terms) of the Euro nations, we get along with them the best. I'm personally a moderate republican(in other words, I have common sense ), putting me to the far right on the European political scale, while I'm located just a little to the right on the U.S. scale.
Kyle posted 05-22-99 02:16 PM ET
Based on society, and not politics, I'd say the British. Way I see it, they (as a society) have been around for so long, and done practically everything, their society has turned out that way. Basically, almost everything the US is going through (in broad societal terms) has been done by the Brits at some point. I get the impression that things don't affect (maybe faze is a better word) them as much as some of the things we're dealing with here.
Of course, this is coming from someone an ocean away, so I could be completely off base.
Hugo Rune posted 05-22-99 04:13 PM ET
'ed: There's more to it than that. Not only is The political spectrum shifted, but the terminology is different as well. You'd be hard pressed to see a "liberal" in britain advocating some of the US liberals' policies.
My fav political spectrum is france's. Considerably to the left of sweden and to the right of the US.
Dutch Boy posted 05-22-99 07:26 PM ET
Although this might be a little off-topic, does anyone agree with me that the Netherlands is the most liberal country in the world ?
Kefaed posted 05-22-99 09:05 PM ET
yeah, I'm guessing you guys consider that a good thing
Imran Siddiqui posted 05-22-99 09:45 PM ET
I agree with Hugo. It depends where you are coming from. The UK (and come to think of it all of Europe) is to the left of the US.
Imran Siddiqui
Chancellor AoYoS posted 05-23-99 12:14 AM ET
Of course everyone knows how socialist I am, at least those who know me. I agree with Hugo also, and that in the US we are still struggling for equality. Hence, (unless recently created and not the neo-nazis) Great Britain doesn't have a KKK. (Correct me if im wrong Eccles).
God Emperor Eccles V posted 05-23-99 06:36 AM ET
Britain does not have a KKK.
hmm (Krusty Komedy Klassics?)
We have a few right-wing nut parties/groups, Combat 18, BNP
but they are small compared with America (or even Europe!) and we have left wing nuts to balance it off.
I think that the major enemy of liberalism in Britain is the 40+ (don't know about the US) most Britons will remember that Landladies would not let Blacks in boarding houses....(also it seems deeply rooted)
Memories of the Empire? That the younger never knew!
I am being whimsical
Tolls posted 05-24-99 06:20 AM ET
Here's one of the more left wing lot we have...they are currently standing around the corner from the office shouting about Kosovo...
http://www.swp.org.uk/
Eccles...as in the cake, or the Goon?
GaryD posted 05-24-99 08:13 AM ET
Ah Socialist Worker.
I recall my university days, trying to avoid that lot selling their papers on the Uni steps.
Happy days...
Tolls posted 05-24-99 11:41 AM ET
I have to battle my way past them to the tube. They hang around by Tottenham Court Road, next to Virgin...
It's quite funny listening to them berating CNN, since that's who I work for...at least partly.
God Emperor Eccles V posted 05-24-99 01:45 PM ET
The Goon show.
SWP ex-voter, and general lay-about.
MikeH II posted 05-25-99 04:52 AM ET
They normally set up in the middle of Reading town center.
Note to self:- Never try to argue with Socialist Worker sellers, no matter how drunk you are.
JohnIII posted 05-25-99 01:57 PM ET
Nonono, it's in Leamington, just outside Woolworths...
John III
High Priest posted 05-25-99 10:10 PM ET

It has to be in how you interpret it, but I'de say the US is more conservative than the UK. But the meanings are so different, even here.
The press loves to act as if conservative means anyone radical. They even said that Chinese(Communist) moderates were far more conservative than most American conservatives. Nazis, fanatical Jews, Communists, fanatical Islamic terrorists, all ultra conservative!
Footnote: never listen to the press for political definitions, especially CNN(bluh)
At any rate, it sometimes is used to mean more religious, which in itself is a poor meaning. If atheists are liberal and religious nuts conservative, guess that would make Nazis liberal socialists??
For the most part, economics is where this plays out. Conservatives generally want the government to stay out of their lives. Disband red tape, cut taxes, disband worthless govt. agencies, etc. In this case, the most conservative party would be the Libertarians. Yet they are sometimes said to be more liberal than Republicans. Liberals generally want lots of govt. restrictions, government interference, taxes, and a large government at that. They also believe(like most socialists) that by cutting income across the board to make rich and poor closer in value is better than making everyone richer.
In this definition, the US is definately conservative. Even the Democratic party is quite a bit more conservative in Euro eyes. I think the American Socialist Party might still be around. Haven't heard anything about them for years, though.
Society like, I'd have to say the US is as equal as other European nations. Of course, we are a nation of immigrants, making it harder for us. That is, however, not counting Affirmative Action, which is pushed mostly by hard line liberals.
There are always exceptions, but popular conservative ideology makes for a very equal, very mobil populace. Republicans might put up the first woman president(Dole).
Oh, and the KKK is pretty much dead here. Due to weak leadership etc., most members are now Neo-Nazis, which is growing quite large(and is English, I might add).
PS: For those who dont know what Affirmitive Action is, it is a law that forces companies of a certain size to hire so many women, minorities. This caused the result of a lot of lawsuits, etc., of white or Asian people who got turned down by a college or university against a much less qualified black or hispanic. It has been banned in a few states, including Texas and California. Doesn't seem like ending racial tension, huh?
High Priest
radical conservative(in his own definition)
Roland posted 05-26-99 03:54 AM ET
Society like, I'd have to say the US is as equal as other European nations.
Definately not on income distribution... one might also argue about some related things, like access to education, health care etc. Btw, I didn't know the US is a european nation ?
GaryD posted 05-26-99 06:26 AM ET
Wishful thinking
Oh, I can't see racial, or any other form of tension, likely to be reduced by blatant discrimination.
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Author	Topic: Who are more Liberal, British or American?
God Emperor Eccles V	posted 05-21-99 07:31 PM ET read the title. A lot of British people seem more tolerant of homosexuals. Also British politics seems a bit more Left than in the US. (Thatcher was an accident, lets not start on the sacred cow) Also British People broke from the Tyranny of the church much earlier than in the US. Remember the Salem Theocracy(not CTP!) Also Prohibition, that was religion crazed, you had you uptight nuts up until a much later time than us. Yes I am British (not English). Discuss
President Korian	posted 05-21-99 08:22 PM ET British, by far.
Frodo83	posted 05-21-99 09:13 PM ET I think that to accurately judge which country is more liberal, one must have lived in both countries for a signifigant amount of time and not rely on past events as a factor. And Mr. President, please explain your reasoning behind your statement.
God Emperor Eccles V	posted 05-22-99 05:56 AM ET I've been in both
Hugo Rune	posted 05-22-99 07:03 AM ET You have to realise the difference in the meaning of the world "liberal" in these two countries to fully comprehend this issue. In the United States, "Liberal" means someone on the left wing of politics, advocating radical change in society. This is not the case in the UK at all. There, a "liberal" is someone quite at the middle of the political spectrum, not quite a conservative but nothing like a real Socialist Either. Most people on the left wing of british politics would scoff if someone called them "liberal". If you look at the americans, on the other hand, Some of your more "liberal" politicians would probably be called "social democrat" if they lived in the UK. Here in sweden, It's even worse. All of our "conservative" parties are actually liberal, quite on par with the democratic party in the US. Then we have socialists and, even worse in the Eyes of americans, Communists. Now, the Socialists and communists are the Feminists, Gay Rights Activists, etc. here in sweden.
Kefaed	posted 05-22-99 01:38 PM ET Yeah, the British are way more to the left on the political spectrum than the U.S. is. However, since they are the most conservative(in U.S. terms) of the Euro nations, we get along with them the best. I'm personally a moderate republican(in other words, I have common sense ), putting me to the far right on the European political scale, while I'm located just a little to the right on the U.S. scale.
Kyle	posted 05-22-99 02:16 PM ET Based on society, and not politics, I'd say the British. Way I see it, they (as a society) have been around for so long, and done practically everything, their society has turned out that way. Basically, almost everything the US is going through (in broad societal terms) has been done by the Brits at some point. I get the impression that things don't affect (maybe faze is a better word) them as much as some of the things we're dealing with here. Of course, this is coming from someone an ocean away, so I could be completely off base.
Hugo Rune	posted 05-22-99 04:13 PM ET 'ed: There's more to it than that. Not only is The political spectrum shifted, but the terminology is different as well. You'd be hard pressed to see a "liberal" in britain advocating some of the US liberals' policies. My fav political spectrum is france's. Considerably to the left of sweden and to the right of the US.
Dutch Boy	posted 05-22-99 07:26 PM ET Although this might be a little off-topic, does anyone agree with me that the Netherlands is the most liberal country in the world ?
Kefaed	posted 05-22-99 09:05 PM ET yeah, I'm guessing you guys consider that a good thing
Imran Siddiqui	posted 05-22-99 09:45 PM ET I agree with Hugo. It depends where you are coming from. The UK (and come to think of it all of Europe) is to the left of the US. Imran Siddiqui
Chancellor AoYoS	posted 05-23-99 12:14 AM ET Of course everyone knows how socialist I am, at least those who know me. I agree with Hugo also, and that in the US we are still struggling for equality. Hence, (unless recently created and not the neo-nazis) Great Britain doesn't have a KKK. (Correct me if im wrong Eccles).
God Emperor Eccles V	posted 05-23-99 06:36 AM ET Britain does not have a KKK. hmm (Krusty Komedy Klassics?) We have a few right-wing nut parties/groups, Combat 18, BNP but they are small compared with America (or even Europe!) and we have left wing nuts to balance it off. I think that the major enemy of liberalism in Britain is the 40+ (don't know about the US) most Britons will remember that Landladies would not let Blacks in boarding houses....(also it seems deeply rooted) Memories of the Empire? That the younger never knew! I am being whimsical
Tolls	posted 05-24-99 06:20 AM ET Here's one of the more left wing lot we have...they are currently standing around the corner from the office shouting about Kosovo... http://www.swp.org.uk/ Eccles...as in the cake, or the Goon?
GaryD	posted 05-24-99 08:13 AM ET Ah Socialist Worker. I recall my university days, trying to avoid that lot selling their papers on the Uni steps. Happy days...
Tolls	posted 05-24-99 11:41 AM ET I have to battle my way past them to the tube. They hang around by Tottenham Court Road, next to Virgin... It's quite funny listening to them berating CNN, since that's who I work for...at least partly.
God Emperor Eccles V	posted 05-24-99 01:45 PM ET The Goon show. SWP ex-voter, and general lay-about.
MikeH II	posted 05-25-99 04:52 AM ET They normally set up in the middle of Reading town center. Note to self:- Never try to argue with Socialist Worker sellers, no matter how drunk you are.
JohnIII	posted 05-25-99 01:57 PM ET Nonono, it's in Leamington, just outside Woolworths... John III
High Priest	posted 05-25-99 10:10 PM ET It has to be in how you interpret it, but I'de say the US is more conservative than the UK. But the meanings are so different, even here. The press loves to act as if conservative means anyone radical. They even said that Chinese(Communist) moderates were far more conservative than most American conservatives. Nazis, fanatical Jews, Communists, fanatical Islamic terrorists, all ultra conservative! Footnote: never listen to the press for political definitions, especially CNN(bluh) At any rate, it sometimes is used to mean more religious, which in itself is a poor meaning. If atheists are liberal and religious nuts conservative, guess that would make Nazis liberal socialists?? For the most part, economics is where this plays out. Conservatives generally want the government to stay out of their lives. Disband red tape, cut taxes, disband worthless govt. agencies, etc. In this case, the most conservative party would be the Libertarians. Yet they are sometimes said to be more liberal than Republicans. Liberals generally want lots of govt. restrictions, government interference, taxes, and a large government at that. They also believe(like most socialists) that by cutting income across the board to make rich and poor closer in value is better than making everyone richer. In this definition, the US is definately conservative. Even the Democratic party is quite a bit more conservative in Euro eyes. I think the American Socialist Party might still be around. Haven't heard anything about them for years, though. Society like, I'd have to say the US is as equal as other European nations. Of course, we are a nation of immigrants, making it harder for us. That is, however, not counting Affirmative Action, which is pushed mostly by hard line liberals. There are always exceptions, but popular conservative ideology makes for a very equal, very mobil populace. Republicans might put up the first woman president(Dole). Oh, and the KKK is pretty much dead here. Due to weak leadership etc., most members are now Neo-Nazis, which is growing quite large(and is English, I might add). PS: For those who dont know what Affirmitive Action is, it is a law that forces companies of a certain size to hire so many women, minorities. This caused the result of a lot of lawsuits, etc., of white or Asian people who got turned down by a college or university against a much less qualified black or hispanic. It has been banned in a few states, including Texas and California. Doesn't seem like ending racial tension, huh? High Priest radical conservative(in his own definition)
Roland	posted 05-26-99 03:54 AM ET Society like, I'd have to say the US is as equal as other European nations. Definately not on income distribution... one might also argue about some related things, like access to education, health care etc. Btw, I didn't know the US is a european nation ?
GaryD	posted 05-26-99 06:26 AM ET Wishful thinking Oh, I can't see racial, or any other form of tension, likely to be reduced by blatant discrimination.