posted 07-21-99 04:13 AM ET        

So, with the past victories I think to myself, I'll jump directly to Tanscend. That way, I'll be able to REALLY, REALLY, REALLY boast about by BELOVED SPARTANS. So today I tried it, everything was going great for me, and then, the moment the base population reaches 2, I have a drone riot!!! Why is that?? And if that's what's suppose to happen, which I think it is, what can I do to keep the drones happy throughout the game!!

The manual says that the levels affect the AI's smartness and aggresiveness, and the thoughness I will have to encounter in establishing and expanding my lovely Spartans. Well then, will the levels also affect the pace of the discovery of technologies for the other factions and me??????(W/0 Tech stagnation) And what other advantages or disadvantages will there be???(for any faction)

I'm not being a wise ass or arrogant or anything like that, but I really wanna win it in Trancend before I try it in Librarian or Thinker.

So please help a poor, dumb Spartan so I can really boast and pit my skills in Multiplayer against other players!!! And as all Spartans like to put it.

posted 07-21-99 06:28 AM ET            

ok early game:
go for impact rovers and try to make as many factions surrender as possible. as the spartans in almost all instances you should choose applied physics as the first tech you research then information networks then nonlinear mathematics if possible. mass at least two impact rovers before you try to take most bases some might need more and a few might need less. choosing police state willlet each one of your garrison units take away two drones (three drones when you add non leathal methods) but expand and conquer as much as possible in the early game

mid game
if you are not at war switch to dem/free marketknowledge and rake in the tech and the money build your infrastructure and scout out threats tht need to be eliminated go to police/green/power (if you have the coommand nexus and cyborg factory forget power stay in knowledge) if you goto war

late game:
use drop rovers to conquer the world usually once you figureout the AI the late game id wide open for you to use any strategy you want

here's some secret projects you need to get

merchant exchange
virtual world
hunter seeker algorithm
super collidor and theory of everything in the same city
cloning vats
command nexus and cyborg factory

set your preferances to allow you to see older threads because they contain good spartan tactics there are also some good general tactics in the transcendent ironman threads in the game section of this forum. and check out this thread at apolyton for some good tactics specific to the spartans

http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum12/HTML/000239.html?date=01:35

hope that helps

korn469

posted 07-21-99 09:23 AM ET            

korn's early game tactics are good. The AI diplomacy engine is very vulnerable in the early game. Even a few Recon Rovers can force your neighbors to give you all their tech. Don't be afraid to demand one of their colonies if it will give you an advantage later (bottleneck colonies, special terrain, etc). Then, once you get Impact Rovers, go conquer. I generally have one Scout Patrol, one Impact Rover and one Former per city. Don't go overboard though. Always work on developing your home cities while making war early on.

Your second citizen will be a drone, so leave a Scout Patrol in each colony. Then, your first structure must be a Rec Commons.
So, your HQ might build Scout, Colony Pod, Former, Recon/Impact Rover, Rec Commons.

Now, here I differ from korn. You can go the ultra energy route, but I think it is very un-Spartan. Dem/Free/Knowledge sounds very Morganesque... ick. I like the immense Police Power and stability of the Green/Police state. His way might be better in the long run, but I like playing in the faction's idiom.

We need not discuss the late game. When you get Shard technology bring a dozen Shard Rovers, Shard Rotors and a few Interceptors over to your neighbors island and conquer them. Rise, Repeat.

I definitely do not agree with korn's SP choices. They sound very Morgan and very un-Spartan. The CN and CF make a sad appearance at the bottom of the list... sigh.

There is only one SP you must have: The Command Nexus. Here's why, and the reason I love the Spartans:

Let Morgan build huge cities, let Zak hoard tech. Every colony on the map belongs to the Spartans. The other factions are simply holding them for you. You can effectively win the game long before things like the cloning vats and the supercollider become available. Just attack, in huge numbers. The computer cannot handle large scale invasions. Over run them. Don't fall into the typical builder falacy of contructing lots of useless buildings and waiting until the end of the game to conquer every other faction. Conquer them as soon as you are able.

They made probe teams for a reason. If Zak is your neighbor, steal from him non-stop. I am especially fond of building a sea colony 4 spaces from an enemy coastal city and using Probe Foils.

Merchant Exchange? Good gawd no. With the Command Nexus and Cyborg Factory every unit the Spartans produce is Elite. I also generally build the Citizens Defense Force and the HSA just so no one else can have them.

posted 07-21-99 10:15 AM ET            

One more thing, I just joined the forum and I'm puzzled that a lot of people playing SMAC commit atrocities as if it's all right!!
No offense intended for those that use this tactic, but it seemed "too much"!! I love to win as much as anybody, but I like to stick to reality!! Obliterating bases horrified me,(I mean executing helpless citizens?!)even though they're not Spartans!
Maybe I'm soft, but I wouldn't commit atrocities unless the enemy initiate it by committing major atrocities to me.(Obliterating bases or Planet busting or Genetic Warfare!) I even forgave the HIVE(imagine that!) for using Nerve gas pods. Well, up until he starts using it on a daily basis! Then I started Planet busting him until his continent turn into a sea!!

posted 07-21-99 10:31 PM ET            

As you can see from some of the posts on this forum itself ("Why the Spartans are Ultimately not Worth Playing", &c...) and from vital statistics revealed from "New Favourite Factions 2," the Spartans are neither the most popular nor the most used faction on planet. Well, actually, they were the first faction that attracted me and such, but, really, for the military aspect, the Believers and Hive are actually better. Spartans are very flexible, and you need to take advantage of that flexibility.

As for not being able to win on transcend, that is probably a skill issue. Maybe you should try gradually building up your skill, then you can handle the headaches that transcend throws at you (in fact, they just become a fact of life after a while. For instance: "What? My citizens aren't revolting and they are at population 5? Oh, right, different difficulty...").

Have fun.

posted 07-22-99 02:33 AM ET            

my appraoch to the midgame differs from your because of one fact, i don't expect to be conquering anyone in the midgame. on a standard size map you can effectively conquer all the factions in 100 years or less. before you go and build the command nexus or any other SP just build a few more impact rovers. unless you are playing on huge map the game should be over by the time you get impact...but you might have to goto gatling, missle, or maybe chaos. by the time the game gets to shard weapons most of the times the game will have already been decided. as long as you are not on a huge map that is mostly water all the buildings you ever need to build are a recreation commons and recycling tank. then just build a 1-1-1 unit (either trance or police) for garrison and then build best weapon-1-2 rover units and the occasion former. that is all you'll ever need for a quick conquest game

here are some se choices to try if you're not going for a quick conquest

police state/green(power) when you are in a conquest mode

democratic/free market/knowledge for lots of money and even more important lots of research

democratic/planned with children's creches for a population boom. with the creches this will give you a +6 growth in thoses cities and as long as you have 2 extra nutrients your population will grow every turn

be flexable...conquer your enemies with police/green then use dem/planned to grow your population rapidly then use dem/FM to reap the rewards of large empire. find your next victem then switch back to police/green don't just stick to one choice be flexable recognize when you need to change.

stay aggressive the AI is bad on defense and everytime you take an AI base see if that faction will surrender. don't just sit there always make sure you are doing something.

posted 07-22-99 03:02 AM ET            

I've been trying to win it on "a huge map" with 50%-70% water coverage. Average erosion forces, and dense rainfall! Playing with standard rule! (Without "TIME WARP") Well, so far not so good. I'm very bad at "SMAC openings".

With "TIME WARP" on, I've tried it twice in Transcend level and won it twice! I tried to get ascent to transcendence but by the time it's available, I've conquered everybody except "submissive Morgan"(always kissing up!).

I even wasted my time using UoP. Twice I tried it, twice the Peacekeepers AI keep breathing down my throat!!! I don't know about you guys, but I just don't see winning by transcendence with UoP if I keep losing to other factions in war!!!

Maybe I have the opening wrong, I am after all bad at it!

I just don't know how to manage the drones and keep my military forces up and running the same time?!!!!(maybe it's impatience?!)

posted 07-22-99 06:14 PM ET            

First let me classify the various victory variations:
1.The player goes for a full conquest victory.
2.The player goes for conquest but wins a diplomatic victory.
3.The player goes for conquest, makes most factions submit but wins by transcendence. This may seem meeningless since the player can win in other ways but it's a very popular strategy for a fast trans victory. There is a fast trans challenge and excellent result have been achieved with this strategy.
4.The player goes for a limited conquest, then plays a builder game and wins by transcendence. (My favorite strategy)
5.The player plays a purely builder game.

It seems that Zorak Zoran goes for full conquest while korn goes for conquest and trancendence that's why they seem to disagree while in fact they just express different strategies, both effective.

What I can say is that the best way to go is search impact rovers. You already have doctrine mobility as the Spartans so you are not far away. The free prototypes of the Spartans help too. One dirty trick you can do is start building a lazer rover and then change it to impact rover at no cost. You have to calculate that you will get the impact technology before you complete the rover.

After you get particle impactor, search (or get) social psych and build recreation commons in your bigger cities. Another way is to keep them small by building colony pods. Also, use police state during the conquest process. After you have conquered what you wanted prepare to change to free market. When you have some submissive pact brothers you will be getting amazing amounts of energy through trade. That's one of the advantages of the Spartans, they can use free market and their research isn't crippled. The Hive or the Believers are good warrior races but they are crippled, in either energy output (Hive) or research (Believers). Also, and this is very important, they don't get impact rovers so quickly as the Spartans.

When I say prepare to change to free market, I mean of course, build recreation commons everywhere, build (or conquer) the Human Genome and the Virtual World and allocate maybe 10% to psych. There is another thing, give far away, conquered cities to your pact brothers, you will be losing than gaining if you keep them.

The way I play, limited conquest then the trip to transcendence, secret projects like the Human Genome or the Virtual World are more important than the Command Nexus. One project that I consider important and nobody mentioned is the Xenoempathy. It helps in war because it gives you mobility and it's helpfull for your formers too.

About your reputation, if you want to play well you have to attack when you are ready, NOT when it's just. If you don't want to commit atrocities it's fine but you have to take the initiative the moment you are ready. Don't give your opponents time to prepare.

posted 07-23-99 08:20 AM ET         

"Let Morgan build huge cities, let Zak hoard tech. Every colony on the map belongs to the Spartans. The other factions are simply holding them for you." -- Zorak, great quote. I laughed out loud when I read it.

I hadn't played SMAC in a few months and I've decided to try the Spartans at Transcend level. It's hard for me because I think I'm a builder by nature (I've previously gone to transcendence as University, Gaians and Morgan). I just wanted to say that the advice you folks have been giving has been very educational to me.

A quick question: I usually have a lot of problem with the Believers. I can't seem to avoid a vendetta with them early in the game and they seem to be on an equal military footing with me, so I get stalled fighting them and everyone else just out-techs me. What am I doing wrong?

The thing I like about SMAC is that the game play is so robust that the game is infinitely replayable. There is no game other than Civ II that I've put as many hours into. I hear that Sid/Brian are going to do Civ III. I can't wait.

posted 07-23-99 08:48 AM ET            

Getting into a war with Miriam is actually a good thing if you are ready for it. Generally, once the Believers start cranking out units to send at you their tech goes even deeper into the toilet.

Expect groups of 6-8 Infantry coming at you. So, just position a handful of Impact Rovers in the path of her invasion and wait. Mind Worms are also great for defense (why I go Police/Green). Use the Command Nexus to quickly repair your damaged rovers.

I basically sit back and let Miriam waste her troops against my Rover/Mind Worm defenses while I tech up to Missiles or Chaos guns. Then, counter attack.

posted 07-23-99 12:30 PM ET         

In my latest game I conquered Zak and Yang quickly, but Miriam was far away and built some good projects, including the command nexus

I'm trying to out tech her, but something pretty interesting just happened. I had a University colony that I had intimidated Zak into giving me near the start of the game. The drones were giving me grief and I nerve stapled them. Zak declared vendetta on me -- and the only reason I can think of (besides maybe Miriam framing me) is the nerve stapling. Hmmph....

Well, I'm going to get back to it now. I think I'll be able to pull things out of the fire eventually. Suggestions?

posted 07-23-99 02:05 PM ET            

Letting Miriam get big is bad, but sometimes you have no influence in the matter. I'd say half the time I watch one faction or another get swallowed up by Miriam or Yang. Facing large, militaritic factions like that takes some diplomatic wrangling. You can basically turn the whole planet against them while you suck up the energy to tech past them.

A Pact sister near Miriam is an advantage: good place to launch probes/assaults from. Get Miriam focusing her attention that way and land a dozen Chaos Rovers as close to her Command Nexus as possible. Take it and spread out fast.

In case you all weren't aware, you can easily trick the computer into making the wrong defensive troops. Spend a few turns blasting away at their cities with Needlejets and the AI will react by building AAA infantry. Once they start appearing, hit them with Rovers.

posted 07-23-99 09:14 PM ET         

> Conquest Victory
> Secret Projects....50
> Technologies.......29
> Energy Reserves...817
> Population........140
> Difficulty..Transcend
> Iron Man........+100%

> Alpha Centauri Score .... 1440
> Alpha Centauri Rating ... 135%

And the key was: Impact Rovers! (Thanks, Zorak.)

Instant Replay: Quick conquest of University and Morgan, a pact with Believers while dividing up the Hive between us. Miriam was pretty big after that, so I switched to Fundamentalist politics to keep her friendly, and then I found the Gaians, upgraded to chaos rovers and forced her to surrender. (Meanwhile, Miriam ate the U.N.)

Umm... actually I was surprised when the game ended. Apparently I was pact sister with everyone and had the cooperative victory mode on. Darn. I wanted to kill everyone.

Top of the world, ma!

Thanks to everyone for your suggestions. This was a very educational and fun (and OK, I've got that ache between the shoulder blades from playing all day).

All shall bow down before me! <booming maniacal laughter>

posted 07-24-99 08:04 AM ET            

9. You do not go to war to die for your faction, you go to war to make the other sad sonofabitch die for his.

posted 07-26-99 08:54 AM ET            

Inix, I did indeed take that out of T1. I was running out of material and it seemed to fit. So, your #9 is Patton... that would make #10....