Believer Difficulty, and my view on Tactics

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Author Topic:   Believer Difficulty, and my view on Tactics

rtoledo7 posted 07-14-99 12:56 AM ET
I've been trying to use the Believers, but I find that they are pretty lame. Their 25% attack advantage is lost when the opponents attack you with their superior tech and weaponry. They miss out on almost all the secret tech, and their research is really backwards. I don't see how you can wage an effective war without effective weaponry. Maybe its because I haven't played the game on a difficulty level higher than Talent, or because I play on a huge map. So far the UoP kicks everyone's @ss with the superior tech. I find that putting them with the social engineering levels on Democratic/Free Market/Wealth, with a Morganite pact, makes you grown tech/population/economywise 3-5x faster than other factions. In times of war, use Police State/green/Power and with your superior units, your enemies will become pretty meaningless. Maybe it's because Im playing on a low difficulty level, and on a huge map. Someone give me their input, please.
Drago Sinio posted 07-14-99 02:13 AM ET
In my few games as a Beleiver, my strategy has been to concentrate on two things, attacking and attacking. I have most of my cities building nothing but infantry units with no armor and best weapon, and a few building rovers, again with best weapon and no armor. You also need to build a few infantry units with best weapon and best armor. A few artillery units are good once you have the tech. You then simply attack the closest city, making sure to concentrate your force all at one place. You use the infantry to attack the base, and the rovers to protect your infantry. I dont care what kind of fancy units the enemy has, 25 or 30 infantry units attacking one city will win every time. The other important thing is probe team use, to steal tech and to sabotage enemy defenses. Miriam has excellent probe teams. And dont bother building SP's, just take the city that does build them.
I also use supply crawlers to work mined squares so that the cities can produce troops quicker. And formers come in handy to raise land bridges to the next victim, er, faction.

Zoetrope posted 07-14-99 05:58 AM ET
Drago's experience matches mine. I've only played one game as the Believers, at Thinker (second highest) level, on a Huge map, and I stomped all over the other factions so badly that weapons of strength 6 were only being developed when I won.
Remember that at the higher levels, whatever faction you play, the AI rivals are building and researching faster, so if there were any difficulty in winning with the Believers, it would be much harder at Thinker than at Talent.
You should aim to get Probe Teams, then forget about researching much tech of your own. Go Fundamentalist for the Morale boost, which is so very valuable in the early game.
Like the AI, my Believers, expand like crazy, travel as fast as they can toward the nearest other faction, build lots of Probe teams and send them to steal all their Tech and break down their Perimeter Defences (they will choose to do this at least 3 times out of 4, and almost always succeed), so your troops face no effective resistance.
Keep the military pressure on at all times, bully for whatever your Probe Teams haven't already taken - tech, energy, even bases. If anyone refuses to give, then take it, relentlessly, constantly, until they surrender or are conquered completely.
Once your army is large, attack multiple bases at once, preferably in different sectors to keep the AI in a spin.
If the enemy capital is within range of your forces, take it early, as most factions are hard hit by this loss.
Play hard, and the Believers will soon be number one in tech as in everything else.
On a Huge map, Mobility is excellent for quickly finding and intimidating your victims. So use Rovers and Seacraft early.
The only big risk is that your army could be backwards when the other factions get Choppers (MMI). But I attacked so hard and furiously that they could not afford the luxury of research: it was all their economy and industry could do to build enough defenders to give me something to roll over. The game was well and truly decided within 100 turns.
Of course, if you do want to get a Project, then the ones you want are Command Nexus, Maritime centre, and Cyborg Factory, so that all your units are created Elite, and your ships travel faster.
By the time you obtain Power as a social choice, the game should be practically won already.
Jaechdan posted 07-14-99 09:39 AM ET
<Caution: Lurker delurking>
I've found two strategies that seem to work.
The first is the Building Believers: Churn out scouts, colonists, formers and more scouts. Stake out a big territory, pop as many pods as you can, try to meet everyone early and trade their tech to everyone else. Build LOTS of cities, try to get the HGP and WP, and go Democratic/Planned for growth. Keep lots of units on the map for worm-hunting and intimidating rivals. If anyone gets in your way, thump them till they surrender, then go back to plan A. Once you're twice the size of anyone else, you should have more money than Morgan, more research than Zak and more votes than Lal.
The second strategy is the Great Crusade. Go all out for production and the Command Nexus. Once you have probe teams and impact weapons, go to Fundamentalism and full military production then beserk across the planet, relying on probes for tech and weight of numbers for victory.
ForemastJack posted 07-14-99 12:28 PM ET
Hm. I've been lurking for several months (unregistered, even), but I wanted to toss in my US$ .02.
I'm playing my first game as the Believers and I love it. For a guy who's been rebelling for years from a *strict* Southern Baptist upbringing, it's something of a paradigm shift.
Anyhoo, I'm finding that the Believers (or, in my case, the Apocolyptic Brethern) can be a great faction, so long as you keep your technology levels at least close to others. If you can nail the Maritime Control Center or the Command Nexus -- and the right SE choices -- you've got some *really* mean troops.
Don't defend. Attack. (Something I have to *remind* myself to do since I'm used to playing Lal.)
Also, I just went completely Psi. Mind Worms and Isles of the Deep. Toss the worms at a monolith before they leave home, and you've *completely* offset any tech. disadvantage you may have. Grab the dream twister and...um...the other one...for defense...and go to town.
I've managed to get involved in a three front war (gee...it worked ok for Hitler...) and, oddly enough, I'm doing better than I was in a one front war. More targets, I guess. I have a hard time *holding* a city, sometimes, but never a hard time taking a city. And besides, for you shouldn't have a problem putting conquered cities to the sword if you're the Believers -- think about the Crusades.
Anyhoo, I like 'em.
FJ
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Author	Topic: Believer Difficulty, and my view on Tactics
rtoledo7	posted 07-14-99 12:56 AM ET I've been trying to use the Believers, but I find that they are pretty lame. Their 25% attack advantage is lost when the opponents attack you with their superior tech and weaponry. They miss out on almost all the secret tech, and their research is really backwards. I don't see how you can wage an effective war without effective weaponry. Maybe its because I haven't played the game on a difficulty level higher than Talent, or because I play on a huge map. So far the UoP kicks everyone's @ss with the superior tech. I find that putting them with the social engineering levels on Democratic/Free Market/Wealth, with a Morganite pact, makes you grown tech/population/economywise 3-5x faster than other factions. In times of war, use Police State/green/Power and with your superior units, your enemies will become pretty meaningless. Maybe it's because Im playing on a low difficulty level, and on a huge map. Someone give me their input, please.
Drago Sinio	posted 07-14-99 02:13 AM ET In my few games as a Beleiver, my strategy has been to concentrate on two things, attacking and attacking. I have most of my cities building nothing but infantry units with no armor and best weapon, and a few building rovers, again with best weapon and no armor. You also need to build a few infantry units with best weapon and best armor. A few artillery units are good once you have the tech. You then simply attack the closest city, making sure to concentrate your force all at one place. You use the infantry to attack the base, and the rovers to protect your infantry. I dont care what kind of fancy units the enemy has, 25 or 30 infantry units attacking one city will win every time. The other important thing is probe team use, to steal tech and to sabotage enemy defenses. Miriam has excellent probe teams. And dont bother building SP's, just take the city that does build them. I also use supply crawlers to work mined squares so that the cities can produce troops quicker. And formers come in handy to raise land bridges to the next victim, er, faction.
Zoetrope	posted 07-14-99 05:58 AM ET Drago's experience matches mine. I've only played one game as the Believers, at Thinker (second highest) level, on a Huge map, and I stomped all over the other factions so badly that weapons of strength 6 were only being developed when I won. Remember that at the higher levels, whatever faction you play, the AI rivals are building and researching faster, so if there were any difficulty in winning with the Believers, it would be much harder at Thinker than at Talent. You should aim to get Probe Teams, then forget about researching much tech of your own. Go Fundamentalist for the Morale boost, which is so very valuable in the early game. Like the AI, my Believers, expand like crazy, travel as fast as they can toward the nearest other faction, build lots of Probe teams and send them to steal all their Tech and break down their Perimeter Defences (they will choose to do this at least 3 times out of 4, and almost always succeed), so your troops face no effective resistance. Keep the military pressure on at all times, bully for whatever your Probe Teams haven't already taken - tech, energy, even bases. If anyone refuses to give, then take it, relentlessly, constantly, until they surrender or are conquered completely. Once your army is large, attack multiple bases at once, preferably in different sectors to keep the AI in a spin. If the enemy capital is within range of your forces, take it early, as most factions are hard hit by this loss. Play hard, and the Believers will soon be number one in tech as in everything else. On a Huge map, Mobility is excellent for quickly finding and intimidating your victims. So use Rovers and Seacraft early. The only big risk is that your army could be backwards when the other factions get Choppers (MMI). But I attacked so hard and furiously that they could not afford the luxury of research: it was all their economy and industry could do to build enough defenders to give me something to roll over. The game was well and truly decided within 100 turns. Of course, if you do want to get a Project, then the ones you want are Command Nexus, Maritime centre, and Cyborg Factory, so that all your units are created Elite, and your ships travel faster. By the time you obtain Power as a social choice, the game should be practically won already.
Jaechdan	posted 07-14-99 09:39 AM ET <Caution: Lurker delurking> I've found two strategies that seem to work. The first is the Building Believers: Churn out scouts, colonists, formers and more scouts. Stake out a big territory, pop as many pods as you can, try to meet everyone early and trade their tech to everyone else. Build LOTS of cities, try to get the HGP and WP, and go Democratic/Planned for growth. Keep lots of units on the map for worm-hunting and intimidating rivals. If anyone gets in your way, thump them till they surrender, then go back to plan A. Once you're twice the size of anyone else, you should have more money than Morgan, more research than Zak and more votes than Lal. The second strategy is the Great Crusade. Go all out for production and the Command Nexus. Once you have probe teams and impact weapons, go to Fundamentalism and full military production then beserk across the planet, relying on probes for tech and weight of numbers for victory.
ForemastJack	posted 07-14-99 12:28 PM ET Hm. I've been lurking for several months (unregistered, even), but I wanted to toss in my US$ .02. I'm playing my first game as the Believers and I love it. For a guy who's been rebelling for years from a strict Southern Baptist upbringing, it's something of a paradigm shift. Anyhoo, I'm finding that the Believers (or, in my case, the Apocolyptic Brethern) can be a great faction, so long as you keep your technology levels at least close to others. If you can nail the Maritime Control Center or the Command Nexus -- and the right SE choices -- you've got some really mean troops. Don't defend. Attack. (Something I have to remind myself to do since I'm used to playing Lal.) Also, I just went completely Psi. Mind Worms and Isles of the Deep. Toss the worms at a monolith before they leave home, and you've completely offset any tech. disadvantage you may have. Grab the dream twister and...um...the other one...for defense...and go to town. I've managed to get involved in a three front war (gee...it worked ok for Hitler...) and, oddly enough, I'm doing better than I was in a one front war. More targets, I guess. I have a hard time holding a city, sometimes, but never a hard time taking a city. And besides, for you shouldn't have a problem putting conquered cities to the sword if you're the Believers -- think about the Crusades. Anyhoo, I like 'em. FJ