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Author Topic:   Hive on Ironman

Bluemax posted 06-11-99 02:22 PM ET
I am making an attempt to play all the factions, except the beleivers, on Transcend Ironman using a random large planet. I have succeeded with the Gaians, Morgan, Peacekeepers, and the UoP. The UoP was tough to get started. I took about a dozen starts before the UoP lasted past turn 100 without getting hopelessly crippled.
Now, I'm trying the hive. Here again, I can't seem to get past turn 150 without somebody hopelessly crippling the faction. Drones are a big problem, even with rec centers and other improvements. I usually try to grab the Weather Paradigm as my first SP. Does anyone know if the Virtual World is a better choice? Is there something else I'm missing?
TheMadStork posted 06-11-99 03:03 PM ET
You can't play the Hive without serious Police help. Their industry bonus comes in quite handy then. Drones should never be a problem with a rec. commons and some police. This means no Free Market economy, but the efficiency constraints on Planned are just what the Chairman ordered.
And the Weather Paradigm is unquestionably the first SP choice; there is nothing else available to equal its effects.
If you play single player as the Hive, remember that Miriam will only expand and conquer. Find her and keep her on the defensive as long as possible before gaining a tech advantage -- build the Hunter-Seeker Algorithm, and she falls hopelessly behind.
I hope that helps.
I go now.
NoMercy posted 06-11-99 04:09 PM ET
I am in a similar situation in that I am currently trying to win on TI. I have successfully completed (usually easily even at Talent) all the other levels with faction but I am having real problems with TI.
My latest (8th or 9th try), and best attempt, is with the Hive and I managed to get The Weather Paradigm, Merchant Exchange and Command Nexus SPs but I'm really being screwed on tech/energy to the extent that the Gaians, UoP and PKs are now building all of the other SPs. (20-30 turns per tech)
No one has gone to war with me yet :-) (probably because I'm second to last on the power graph :-( )
I like to play builder with lots of terraformers, bore-holes & echelon mirrors outside of base perimeter and forests inside.
Any thoughts?
Zozo posted 06-11-99 04:41 PM ET
I had no problem with the Hive even in the worst game when I started near the Believer and had to spend all the early years getting Mirriam to surrender and leaving the Gainnes to get most of the SPs and be on top on almost all catetegories.
You should make use of the crawlers and foil crawlers to boost up the production of minerals and ennergy. Have a few foil crawlers collecting energy and food for your science city (the one with the Merchant Exachange) to get grow fast and produces good science output.
bigcanuk posted 06-12-99 01:12 PM ET
Drone probs with Hive??
With industry and growth advantage, your only prob with Hive should be everyone else ganging up on you because you are ahead.
1. police state as soon as 40 credits.
2. make scouts and colony pods. Scouts for police and to explore, colony pods to keep pops below 3 or 4 and to establish more bases
3. when you get cent ecology, make formers and colony pods. Formers plant forest exclusively, except for rainy, rolling, inland, above 1000' which get farm, solar.
4. when you get doct: flex build sea formers for kelp, tidal harness.
5. when you get planetary networks go planned. build probes(sea and land). steal tech. buy an impact rover if you haven't researched it yet.
6. continue to build while you crush your opponents.
7. when you get intell integrity, build police scout. upgrade existing scouts to police as nesc. to quiet drones. 3police=6 rec com=2 therefore no drones to pop of 8.
later with ascetic virtues, 3 police=9, rec com + hol theatre(or preferably virt world + net node) = 4, no drones to pop of 13.
8. happy hunting
Sorry, I just have to be a little more long winded. Virt world is important for Hive. They are energy poor, and a net node costs 1 energy, and a hol theatre costs 3. Therefore, the hive(and every other faction) saves 2 or 3 energy per base per turn!!
Rimmer posted 06-12-99 01:39 PM ET
A 1-1-1 police unit costs 10 min. Although useless against your opponents they keep you cities under control, are cheap, and if moral is good defend well against psi attacks. You can even make them clean for 10 more min.
AJR B.S.C. S.S.C.
Spraying the glowing urine of knowledge into the mouths of the ignorant.

M_ashwell posted 06-14-99 07:44 AM ET
rimmer BSC SSC
bronze swimming certificate
silver swimming certificate
i ALWAYS play as the hive so con shaer some info to any hive-virgins!!
have a couple of bases on stockpile energy and there goes the downside
i play frontier/green/knolage/cybernetic this keeps me ahead in the tech (unless on trancendence level where it is nearly impossible to keep up even against the beleivers!) with the V3 patch i am considering to take up police state as it has no bad effects just expand untll u meat some one ...
then kill the BASTARDS do this another 6 times and hey presto
oh by the way do the gaians hate the hive cause i got planet-busted in my 1st game against them this was on citisen level suffice to say i ... retalated, yes thats the word for busting all their bases. so i got thrown out of the council so sue me the gaians never bothered me again (i think the morganites were PLEASED at their removal)
ok thats my pennys worth
bye
Martyn
Bluemax posted 06-21-99 09:32 AM ET
Success! Thanks for the help. After some of these quick changes, things went a lot better. An interesting thing happened that I had not seen before - the AI planet busting a secret project. The end game wound up with the Hive 1/3 of planet bases, Peacekeepers 2/3rds. The Peaceniks kept probing for technology (I managed some bases for tech benefits, so I was ahead). I got tired of being probed, so I located which PK city had the hunter-seeker algorithm and made a go for it. On the turn immediately after I took the SP and fortified the heck out of it, the PK nuked it. The PB also took out two PK bases nearby with a combined population of 15. My compliments to the AI, if you can't own it, blow it up! I lost tech through probing through the rest of the game, but the PK were so far behind that by the time they caught up in technology, they had lost their resource base.
Igor posted 06-22-99 08:48 AM ET
One more thing. If you play Blind research Off, go to Cybernetic and build PDL.
Next goal is Industrial Automation and Wealth, but only for large-huge map. With -1=0 economy and no penalties Hive grows as mad. When start, expand, but it is important for any faction. Hive has one of the best (mayby best) chance for fast expansion.
If you are not very aggressive when contact with faction, it is possible to buy techs. Even if you will be w/o money after this, buy it.
Weather Paradigm is good project, but every base can support 2-4 formers and this SP is not so important. CN and HG are much better.
jimmytrick posted 06-22-99 09:03 AM ET
Kinda off topic here, but....
I thought I would mention that in playing the Moses to the Mountain Challenge, wherein I am limited to building 5 SPs, I built the Cloning Vats and the Spartans quickly blew the base up.
So, hats off to Firaxis, they did put some thought into this stuff.....
Earwicker posted 06-22-99 12:30 PM ET
>>>One more thing. If you play Blind research Off, go to Cybernetic and build PDL.
Should be "build Network Backbone" to eliminate the Cybernetic penalty.
The chief advantage of WP as an early SP is the ability to leap ahead tech-wise in terms of what the formers can do (although some UoP games the formers are already busy building boreholes before the SP is finished). There is also the lasting benefit of every former being a superformer, and superformers being superduperformers.
Igor posted 06-23-99 05:04 AM ET
To Earwicker:
Yeah, I thought about 'Cybernetic' tech If you have prolems here, it's about ~2300-2350, not first 150 turns .
WP is a good project, no objections. But CN gives morale bonus, which helps when switching to Wealth. HG eleminates drone problems if you grow too fast and have a lot of bases. Hive cant increase efficiency and drones hurt him a bit more then other factions.
To jimmytrick:
When I started playsmac (Talent?), I was nuked by Gaians. My capitol with bunch of projects went away I reload saved game and tried again. We pleged truce, but new 'surprisely' attack form Gaians and I captured next Gaians base (their Gaja's Landing ). Ooopppss... New PB and fresh water crater..... Gaia's Landing with two projects..
laurens posted 06-23-99 10:54 AM ET
You can win real fast with the Hive even on transcend - juz switch to Police/Planned model and that will give you a force same as that of the Believers as well as a growth rate that helps you to pump up the score.
In fact, if you favor fast conquest, you might never get to any tech advances level 5/6 or above.
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Author	Topic: Hive on Ironman
Bluemax	posted 06-11-99 02:22 PM ET I am making an attempt to play all the factions, except the beleivers, on Transcend Ironman using a random large planet. I have succeeded with the Gaians, Morgan, Peacekeepers, and the UoP. The UoP was tough to get started. I took about a dozen starts before the UoP lasted past turn 100 without getting hopelessly crippled. Now, I'm trying the hive. Here again, I can't seem to get past turn 150 without somebody hopelessly crippling the faction. Drones are a big problem, even with rec centers and other improvements. I usually try to grab the Weather Paradigm as my first SP. Does anyone know if the Virtual World is a better choice? Is there something else I'm missing?
TheMadStork	posted 06-11-99 03:03 PM ET You can't play the Hive without serious Police help. Their industry bonus comes in quite handy then. Drones should never be a problem with a rec. commons and some police. This means no Free Market economy, but the efficiency constraints on Planned are just what the Chairman ordered. And the Weather Paradigm is unquestionably the first SP choice; there is nothing else available to equal its effects. If you play single player as the Hive, remember that Miriam will only expand and conquer. Find her and keep her on the defensive as long as possible before gaining a tech advantage -- build the Hunter-Seeker Algorithm, and she falls hopelessly behind. I hope that helps. I go now.
NoMercy	posted 06-11-99 04:09 PM ET I am in a similar situation in that I am currently trying to win on TI. I have successfully completed (usually easily even at Talent) all the other levels with faction but I am having real problems with TI. My latest (8th or 9th try), and best attempt, is with the Hive and I managed to get The Weather Paradigm, Merchant Exchange and Command Nexus SPs but I'm really being screwed on tech/energy to the extent that the Gaians, UoP and PKs are now building all of the other SPs. (20-30 turns per tech) No one has gone to war with me yet :-) (probably because I'm second to last on the power graph :-( ) I like to play builder with lots of terraformers, bore-holes & echelon mirrors outside of base perimeter and forests inside. Any thoughts?
Zozo	posted 06-11-99 04:41 PM ET I had no problem with the Hive even in the worst game when I started near the Believer and had to spend all the early years getting Mirriam to surrender and leaving the Gainnes to get most of the SPs and be on top on almost all catetegories. You should make use of the crawlers and foil crawlers to boost up the production of minerals and ennergy. Have a few foil crawlers collecting energy and food for your science city (the one with the Merchant Exachange) to get grow fast and produces good science output.
bigcanuk	posted 06-12-99 01:12 PM ET Drone probs with Hive?? With industry and growth advantage, your only prob with Hive should be everyone else ganging up on you because you are ahead. 1. police state as soon as 40 credits. 2. make scouts and colony pods. Scouts for police and to explore, colony pods to keep pops below 3 or 4 and to establish more bases 3. when you get cent ecology, make formers and colony pods. Formers plant forest exclusively, except for rainy, rolling, inland, above 1000' which get farm, solar. 4. when you get doct: flex build sea formers for kelp, tidal harness. 5. when you get planetary networks go planned. build probes(sea and land). steal tech. buy an impact rover if you haven't researched it yet. 6. continue to build while you crush your opponents. 7. when you get intell integrity, build police scout. upgrade existing scouts to police as nesc. to quiet drones. 3police=6 rec com=2 therefore no drones to pop of 8. later with ascetic virtues, 3 police=9, rec com + hol theatre(or preferably virt world + net node) = 4, no drones to pop of 13. 8. happy hunting Sorry, I just have to be a little more long winded. Virt world is important for Hive. They are energy poor, and a net node costs 1 energy, and a hol theatre costs 3. Therefore, the hive(and every other faction) saves 2 or 3 energy per base per turn!!
Rimmer	posted 06-12-99 01:39 PM ET A 1-1-1 police unit costs 10 min. Although useless against your opponents they keep you cities under control, are cheap, and if moral is good defend well against psi attacks. You can even make them clean for 10 more min. AJR B.S.C. S.S.C. Spraying the glowing urine of knowledge into the mouths of the ignorant.
M_ashwell	posted 06-14-99 07:44 AM ET rimmer BSC SSC bronze swimming certificate silver swimming certificate i ALWAYS play as the hive so con shaer some info to any hive-virgins!! have a couple of bases on stockpile energy and there goes the downside i play frontier/green/knolage/cybernetic this keeps me ahead in the tech (unless on trancendence level where it is nearly impossible to keep up even against the beleivers!) with the V3 patch i am considering to take up police state as it has no bad effects just expand untll u meat some one ... then kill the BASTARDS do this another 6 times and hey presto oh by the way do the gaians hate the hive cause i got planet-busted in my 1st game against them this was on citisen level suffice to say i ... retalated, yes thats the word for busting all their bases. so i got thrown out of the council so sue me the gaians never bothered me again (i think the morganites were PLEASED at their removal) ok thats my pennys worth bye Martyn
Bluemax	posted 06-21-99 09:32 AM ET Success! Thanks for the help. After some of these quick changes, things went a lot better. An interesting thing happened that I had not seen before - the AI planet busting a secret project. The end game wound up with the Hive 1/3 of planet bases, Peacekeepers 2/3rds. The Peaceniks kept probing for technology (I managed some bases for tech benefits, so I was ahead). I got tired of being probed, so I located which PK city had the hunter-seeker algorithm and made a go for it. On the turn immediately after I took the SP and fortified the heck out of it, the PK nuked it. The PB also took out two PK bases nearby with a combined population of 15. My compliments to the AI, if you can't own it, blow it up! I lost tech through probing through the rest of the game, but the PK were so far behind that by the time they caught up in technology, they had lost their resource base.
Igor	posted 06-22-99 08:48 AM ET One more thing. If you play Blind research Off, go to Cybernetic and build PDL. Next goal is Industrial Automation and Wealth, but only for large-huge map. With -1=0 economy and no penalties Hive grows as mad. When start, expand, but it is important for any faction. Hive has one of the best (mayby best) chance for fast expansion. If you are not very aggressive when contact with faction, it is possible to buy techs. Even if you will be w/o money after this, buy it. Weather Paradigm is good project, but every base can support 2-4 formers and this SP is not so important. CN and HG are much better.
jimmytrick	posted 06-22-99 09:03 AM ET Kinda off topic here, but.... I thought I would mention that in playing the Moses to the Mountain Challenge, wherein I am limited to building 5 SPs, I built the Cloning Vats and the Spartans quickly blew the base up. So, hats off to Firaxis, they did put some thought into this stuff.....
Earwicker	posted 06-22-99 12:30 PM ET >>>One more thing. If you play Blind research Off, go to Cybernetic and build PDL. Should be "build Network Backbone" to eliminate the Cybernetic penalty. The chief advantage of WP as an early SP is the ability to leap ahead tech-wise in terms of what the formers can do (although some UoP games the formers are already busy building boreholes before the SP is finished). There is also the lasting benefit of every former being a superformer, and superformers being superduperformers.
Igor	posted 06-23-99 05:04 AM ET To Earwicker: Yeah, I thought about 'Cybernetic' tech If you have prolems here, it's about ~2300-2350, not first 150 turns . WP is a good project, no objections. But CN gives morale bonus, which helps when switching to Wealth. HG eleminates drone problems if you grow too fast and have a lot of bases. Hive cant increase efficiency and drones hurt him a bit more then other factions. To jimmytrick: When I started playsmac (Talent?), I was nuked by Gaians. My capitol with bunch of projects went away I reload saved game and tried again. We pleged truce, but new 'surprisely' attack form Gaians and I captured next Gaians base (their Gaja's Landing ). Ooopppss... New PB and fresh water crater..... Gaia's Landing with two projects..
laurens	posted 06-23-99 10:54 AM ET You can win real fast with the Hive even on transcend - juz switch to Police/Planned model and that will give you a force same as that of the Believers as well as a growth rate that helps you to pump up the score. In fact, if you favor fast conquest, you might never get to any tech advances level 5/6 or above.