posted 05-29-99 09:06 PM ET        

Here is an analysis of the Spartans:

In terms of military, the Spartans generally go for quality, not quantity. Look at their philosophy, for instance:

"Well-trained, well-equipped troops can stand up to many more times their lesser brethren than linear arithmetic would seem to indicate"

-Col. Corazon Santiago
Spartan Battle Manual

Without any boosts from Social Engineering, their units pop out of their bases with, at least, disciplined status. This, however, is balanced by their (-1) industry rating, which means everything else costs 10% more for them to make. Even still, their early armies can be quick (Doctrine: Mobility) and powerful. They do not have an intrinsic positive 'Green' rating, yet their generally high morale means that their psionic warriors can start at relatively high levels. Even if the Believers have a 25% attack bonus, their lagging tech compensates for this. One of Sparta's main priorities is 'Discover,' for technology is an important asset of the military.

Well, those are some of my thoughts.
I await comments and analyses of other factions.

posted 05-30-99 02:08 AM ET            

1) Spartans have to do their own research. The Believers can just take it from others.

2) Believers have +2 support. They can support 4 free units per base.

3) That -1 industry really starts to cripple in the mid-game with the higher-tech units.

4) The Spartans can never use Wealth. This means their economy is in the tank unless they use FM, which they can't, if they want to fight. The Believers, using Wealth, can make much more money.

posted 05-30-99 09:34 AM ET            

You also said that all you had to do was steal tech. Well, this leaves you dependent on other factions, which leaves you highly susceptible to placement factors within the game. It is not a very versatile approach. I, for one, like to do my own research--upright idealism--and I like to annihilate my neighbouring faction with weapons that are 50 years ahead of them.

Well, thanks for your responses. Any other factions? I would especially like to hear an argument for the 'pacifist' Gaians.

posted 05-30-99 09:59 AM ET            

As for the Gaians, much as I like favor psi dominance in my games but I don't think they would get any realistic chance here at all because of their inherited morale disadv. To offset this would require social eng choices like fundamental which would upset their research, or power settings that make them worse than the Spartans' -1 industry. Cloning Vats might help, but it might just be a bit too late.

posted 06-01-99 08:51 AM ET            

As laurens posted, Fundy upsets their research, but in one of my latest games with Gaians they could do breakthrough every 8 turns under Fundy/Green/Power compare to 5 under Demo/Green/Knowledge, and 7 under Police/Green/Power. Moreover, +4 effic means a lot of small bases with less drone problem, bigger building ability and higher support. And if you have in mind Command Nexus, not Weather Paradigm, their troops are very very good. If I start war from first contact with other faction, and dont stop it at all, Power goes in the latest game (often I steal it from UoP or Sparta) and Gaians dont have -2 industry penalty. Using standart rules gives Fundy and Green very fast, and then simple switching to Conquer-Explorer priorities gives reasonable weapons for any war.

I think, what Missle (?) launcher with strengh 6 not worse than Chaos gun. If you was attacked in field, you need at least Photon shield to survive. I think, nobody sets Silksteel as research priority, and Missle is also useful when attack a base.

Personally, I like trained troops and build them if I can.

Many people said about psi warfare, so I won't repeat it. Combination conventional-psi is more flexible, and gives more bonuses then only one type of troops. I tried the same with PK (Fundy/Green/Power), but it wasnt so effective, probably because I got Green late enough, and other factions had high-morale troops.

And if you build only Recicling Tank, Rec Common and Command Center (true survival tactic), your bases give you enough units even with -2 industry penalty. I dont know, how people like to fight, but I produce many units and lose a lot of them, so support is not a problem in the start. When their morale increases, I have Power and high support with tons of bases.

Only one problem for Deidre in the very beggining is Hive with his huge support, FREE PERIMETER DEFENCE and quick industry. Gaians have faster research and can get Impact weapons fast enough to fight with Hive's bases (if they play in fungus-poor world), and rovers for preventing Yang's sprouting.

I think people dislike Fundamentalism, but, IMHO, Green faction is second best user of it after True Believers. Of course, Gaians are also second in using Police State, but I need effic, because I grow and grow and grow, and +2 effic help a bit with drones. Police compare to Fundy gives one more police unit and one more unit in field (2-1=1, and 4-2=2), but this units have less morale, and if bases (Green choice) dont grow very fast, Rec Common is better than 1 more police troop.

Sorry, I think it was not exactly about superiority of Gaians, but more how to win using Gaia's conventional troops. I think that Deidre is more efficient in diplomacy and peaceful growth (remeber, she is a 'peaceful' girl), but sometime it is funny to play her as warmonger.

posted 06-01-99 09:35 PM ET         

With a early PDs and the Command Nexus, Yang can whip Santiago in the early stages. Not to mention +2support, +2police, +3growth, and +2industry. In peace times he can conveniently switch to wealth(sometimes in war, too) and lose the Economy negative, and get +3 industry. What he can't have because of faction penalties, he can take with vassals and SPs. In some TI games, I've gotten all SPs(available) minus the CDF.

Though Santiago might have her veteran troops(with Fundy & monoliths) to match Yang, Yang has a whole lot more(with CN & monoliths) troops, with a high support and industry rating. Growth is essential, and even though Hive can't get early pop. booms, his steady +3 growth will outmatch those who rely on brief periods of boom, where their SE suffers other penalties. Plus as long as you're playing him right, you should get the Vats.

The free PD and police rating makes conquest much easier. New bases automatically become fortresses and staging areas, instead of worthless enemy magnets that are hard to defend. It also allows you to not worry about ever building PDs(unless destroyed by worms).

The final unseen bonus with PDs, is that it can free your factories to make other SPs, while the AI all run off at CDF. The police can keep the drone monster off your back in the crucial point that you need conquered bases producing like hell.

Oh, and I forgot to mention that early on, Yang can research as fast as anyone, provided you get the edge in growth. He's also extremely useful for getting early vassals. This can really boost your cash and research.

As to the Believers, I haven't had much experience with them, but I know from fighting them that if they aren't close to a host faction(like UoP), they fall behind severly in tech. They are rarely the most powerful faction. Although they're usually pacted with units, they're often outdated, and they seldom have a good defense.

At any rate, versus Santiago, Yang rules in the conquer arena.

posted 06-03-99 01:11 PM ET            

I do not know much about the "government running" or paper-pushing part of it. I am a soldier plain and simple.

I have started splitting my forces into four to six fronts (north, south ect...) and allowing those local bases to support and them.

The Navy (Hurrah) is the shinning star. Submarines, Fighter/Chopter Carriers, Battleships, Cruisers, Destroyers and Marines always have a place in my military

As for "Strategies" the best defense is a good assault strike with missiles, shore bombardments and beach landings followed up by lightning raids.

posted 06-04-99 04:36 PM ET         

Hey, he's against just about everything I stand for in real life, thats why I chose him later than others.

Play him right, and you'll see he is by far the best faction

Anyway, I kind of like his quotes, they are the most interesting.

posted 06-05-99 12:28 AM ET            

"But why?" I hear many of you say. "Think of the Drones!". Well, I'll tell you.

Not much can resist a score (20) of Clean Graviton Gravships.

In my last game as the UoP, I was far ahead of the others in tech, and once had two allies: The Peacekeepers and the Morganites. For no good reason, other than that I was too powerful (you think they'd try sucking up instead of trying to make me mad) they broke it off. The Hive & Spartans were thw two next most powerful, and I was a practicing pacifist at that point in the game, I avoided them.

After I got graviton theory (gravships) I built a seabase, equipped it with a punishment sphere, made all my gravships clean and sent them there for re-homing before I sent them all to Morganland, a war that I won in 3 turns.

I then turned my greedy eyes to the rich North (hmm...sounding like Sauron there...beware! the Red Eye is watching!) and, having built the Telepathic Matrix, I sent my force of Gravships and all newly built ones up north, indending to teach the Peacekeeper a lesson about how you should be nice to your allies (in the words of Sean Bean in "Goldeneye", "[Lal} is about to learn the cost of betrayal.")

But alas, I could not, as the path was blocked by the Spartans, mainly, and event though I could crush them easily, I didn't want to quite yet. So I destroyed the Gaians and attacked the Believers (Hive had beaten them down to four or five seabases) until they made an offer for peace, which I accepted as I only had two gravships in the vicinity and were preparing the others for a blitzkrieg on the Hive.

I swiftly took the Hive (city, not faction) and didn't go much farther at the time.

You see, my goal was to win by Transcendence, so I was just trying to make sure that nobody else would beat me to it. At this point, I believe I was building Voice.

I nuked the Hive, eliminating three of their cities and The Hive, which I had taken. (oops)

After nuking two or three more times, I built Ascent to Transcendence.

posted 06-07-99 10:03 PM ET            

'It was not a battle but an execution'
--comment on the British subjugation of Sudan, 1898

posted 06-11-99 05:09 AM ET            

Thing is, as alot of people said, SMAC is too easy. If you use a little bit of strategy then you can achieve mostly anything.

As for the answer to best conquering faction I'd say that it's a time related question :

Early Stage of Game : Spartans and Believers
Very early it's the spartan cuz they usually have the military tech advance AND most importantly they have mapped most territory and knows their objectives.
If anger the believer early on, they are really tough with that 25% advantage that you can't counter with Tech (early on) or industry...

Early Mid Stage : The Hive
And on this, I'd say the AI is pretty good cuz the computer knows that. You will rarely see a game when Yang doesn't make a move between developpment of Command Nexus and the Sea SP...

Late Mid Stage : Gaians
If they havn't been wiped out by Miram or Yang, the little tree-hunger becomes suddenly big after she got say 20-30 bases... Those worms of her makes for a potent army and since usually people don't have the time to develop the mind enhancing SP at this stage she starts to be very dangerous, not to mention that if she's not bothered she's right next to UoP for Tech research
Late Stages : PK,Morgan, UoP
And in that order. PK can at this point pratically win the diplomatic game if they havn't been crippled by the conquerors. Morgan will buy is way out and UoP will get that shot at transcend any time soon. Also the thing is those 3 will probably have a big developpment and tech advance if they have been left alone, and with tech and industry comes military supremacy...

posted 06-11-99 10:08 AM ET            

"That -1 industry really starts to cripple in the mid-game with the higher-tech units."

No, it doesn't. By mid-game, you've got the city growth to help make up for it. It's in the /early/ game that -Industry hurts, IMO.

"The Spartans can never use Wealth. This means their economy is in the tank unless they use FM, which they can't, if they want to fight."

I never use either Wealth or Free Market. The game I finished last night as the Spartans, I was making as much as 1000 Energy a turn (until I turned down economy percentage). I could've been making more but I'd been concentrating on mineral and nutrient production instead of energy production until later in the game.
(I was playing Green/Knowledge, +Cybernetic after I built the appropriate SP to couteract the negs to that.)

posted 06-11-99 04:07 PM ET            

I did not say that the advantages could be reached exclusively on lower levels:

"(I suppose the same is true for higher levels)"

The level of difficulty is a moot point. That is relative to a person's skill. The point was which faction has an inherently natural advantage over others. Certainly, you can twist faction characteristics to make a Morgan Industries of the Spartans, for instance, but, within that framework, the Morgans have the potential of exceeding the Spartans on their own grounds.

Which brings up the point: which characteristics or combination of characteristics make the best conquering faction? For instance, is industry more important or morale? The following is my own assessment:

Automatic morale boost is important in short war games, but in long and drawn out wars, industry would be far more important. Look at the Germans in WWI and WWII. Their industry had maxed out before the United States entered, and a newly mobilised U.S. slaughtered the Germans. (Though I suppose equating real life to SMAC is an ambiguous argument at best) Still, in a long and indecisive war, the more troops you can build, the better. The army is more mobile this way.

In Civ, I found that technology was a huge advantage in war. I was the first to develop Steam Engine and I blew away bases with my fleet of Ironclads and moved my horsies in. I have crippled whole civilisations this way.

With SMAC, however, (as I mentioned earlier) the level of military power in relation to advancements in technology rises by increments of one. So, there are very few 'revolutionary' techs in terms of warfare.

posted 06-18-99 09:51 AM ET            

But the first time I tried the Believers, I walked over everyone from the start. The Hive were an especial pushover for my Conclave troops.

The Perimeter Defences mean nothing: my first Elite Probe Team would be set on arbitrary sabotage, and would take down the PD immediately; if by chance it picked another target, the second Probe (as Miriam, I used lots of Probes) always demolished the PD; then Artillery followed by Combined Arms Elite assault force would wipe the floor with Yang's best defenders.

Spartans? The only time I played them at Thinker it was slow and painful. I never had money, built very slowly, and took ages to conquer the world.

The Believers were _so_ much easier to win with than the other factions; I even had time to do perfunctory research and significant building while my armies were out conquering; nothing slowed me down.

With any other faction, I got occasional reverses and unpleasant surprises; with the Believers, I didn't need to commit any atrocities or use any superior weapons to wipe the floor with everyone.

posted 06-23-99 05:43 PM ET         

The best conquering factions, IMO, are Gaians and Hives. The Hive can switch to Police State/Planned combo without suffering anything negative. That combo gives the Hive +2 Support, +2 Police, +2 Industry, and +Growth, enough to crank out large number of units. The Hive also have free Perimeter defenses, allowing them to hold newly controlled bases. They can build Command Nexus early and quickly, too.

On the other hand, the Gaians have two powerful advantages: one being their +2 efficiency, the second being their Psi ability. +2 Eff allows the Gaians to use Police State/Green/Knowledge social combo. That gives +3 Eff, +2 Research, +3 Planet, +2 Support, and +1 Police. The -2 Growth doesn't really hurt, you would have trouble with drones at Transcend level anyway. Cloning Vats will take care of weak growth. Psi combat has some real advantages: you can recruit mindworms; you don't need to pay expensive upgrade; you ignore Perimeter Defenses(good vs Hive); and worms could not be probed(safe vs Believers).

posted 06-25-99 12:15 AM ET            

http://www.an.i-dentity.com/ac.cgi/main

posted 06-29-99 01:18 PM ET            

I am currently involved in a PBEM game entitled 'The Archives,' and I am the University of Planet. I have, of late, become extremely aggressive and have ignited a war with the Believers--thus far, moderately successful. I am using a war combo for SE--don't remember what it is exacty--but I am having a problem with research. My research is at a virtual standstill and the Gaians have surpassed me in tech. I would argue the point that the University can still do good research while fighting. I am having a problem...