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Author Topic:   A Fig Leaf

yin26 posted 03-17-99 05:52 AM ET
I'd like to offer this post as the complementary guide to Brother Greg's tome.
Now that we have tasted from the Tree of Knowledge and felt ashamed in our nakedness, peace (and a bit of a chill) have settled on the land. This is good, right?
Here's the problem as I see it:
The "old-timers" were here long before the game was even released. They gave feedback to Firaxis. Who knows, they maybe even helped make the game better than it would have been had they not been here. To them, and rightly so, this game is their baby.
Now, if somebody were to come to my house and criticize my two month old girl (I do have a two month old girl, BTW--the drinks are on me)--I don't think I could stand to listen.
"Her head's too big."
"Shut the hell up or die!"
That's basically what I would say. Could you fault me? Maybe. Would you understand my reaction? Of course.
So, I understand the aversion to criticism here. I really do.
But that's not the real problem.
You see, this is going to be cyclical. You old-timers are going to see more and more waves of people posting here for the first time as more and more people buy the game. Sure, some will be positive. Many others will offer the (by now) same old, hashed and re-hashed stuff you've heard a million times. The old-time complainers, like me, will have long moved on, but in rolls yin27 and, oh hell, here we go again.
Since it doesn't really matter to me what will happen (since patch 3.0 will shut me up either way), I just would like to offer this advice because I have grown to like you people:
Pretend you've never heard the criticism before.
I know. That's going to be hard. But it bears repeating:
These people are posting their often legitimate complaints about a game that they passionately wanted to love. They may not all do it in a civil manner at first, but some of them think they are entering the snake pit and need to bite or get bitten. True, that's their fault, not yours.
Let them vent. Coax some sense out of them. Listen first, defend the game second.
If you do that, I guarantee this board will be a much happier place and you'll possibly make friends out of people who were determined to make enemies.
It's you guys, not the newbies, who control the tone of the board, and this is the most effective way.
Sure, the periodic spaz will show up looking to make nothing but trouble. You'll know who they are--not because they criticize--but because they won't engage in conversation after you've listened and tried to understand.
Those people you ignore.
People like me, you try to forget.
If March 19th gives me what I hope it will, you'll soon get your chance.
"Don't cry for me, Argentina!"
General of the Armies,
Yin
P.S. I'll still be available for Forum consultations after the 19th, so, Brother Greg, keep my e-mail handy...
Aredhran posted 03-17-99 06:44 AM ET
An Olive Branch...
A Fig Leaf...
Are you all turning Green or what ?
(brainwashed by Deirdre maybe )
-Aredhran
HMFIC posted 03-17-99 08:41 AM ET
Vendetta on whoever nerve stapled yin26!
Bdot posted 03-17-99 08:54 AM ET
but then it's a lot of us oldbies that are the ones complaining.. the ones who were here since the beginning and expected something than what was created. That's the problem with pre-hype and baords like this. It creates an incorrect image of that the game will be. Maybe that's why I liked Civ II so much better. I had no idea there was a game called Civ II til I went to a friends apartment and they were playing it. There was no pre-image of what the game would be.
woodelf posted 03-17-99 08:58 AM ET
"Drone riots have ended"
Seriously HMFIC, that made me laugh out loud at work about the stapling.
Since I'm one of the newer posters although I've had the game since day 1, I appreciate the help from the "old-timers". I've yet to be truly flamed even though my "Choppers" post was lame for sure. It is hard to sift through archived data especially when some of the best tips come in off-topic posts.
Freddz posted 03-17-99 09:40 AM ET
I guess this is as much a peacekeeper as anything. If I didn't know better, I would think you may have eavesdropped on some of my posts.
Amen, sister Yin, peace it is.
December Man posted 04-20-99 04:46 PM ET
. . .another golden moment. . .
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Author	Topic: A Fig Leaf
yin26	posted 03-17-99 05:52 AM ET I'd like to offer this post as the complementary guide to Brother Greg's tome. Now that we have tasted from the Tree of Knowledge and felt ashamed in our nakedness, peace (and a bit of a chill) have settled on the land. This is good, right? Here's the problem as I see it: The "old-timers" were here long before the game was even released. They gave feedback to Firaxis. Who knows, they maybe even helped make the game better than it would have been had they not been here. To them, and rightly so, this game is their baby. Now, if somebody were to come to my house and criticize my two month old girl (I do have a two month old girl, BTW--the drinks are on me)--I don't think I could stand to listen. "Her head's too big." "Shut the hell up or die!" That's basically what I would say. Could you fault me? Maybe. Would you understand my reaction? Of course. So, I understand the aversion to criticism here. I really do. But that's not the real problem. You see, this is going to be cyclical. You old-timers are going to see more and more waves of people posting here for the first time as more and more people buy the game. Sure, some will be positive. Many others will offer the (by now) same old, hashed and re-hashed stuff you've heard a million times. The old-time complainers, like me, will have long moved on, but in rolls yin27 and, oh hell, here we go again. Since it doesn't really matter to me what will happen (since patch 3.0 will shut me up either way), I just would like to offer this advice because I have grown to like you people: Pretend you've never heard the criticism before. I know. That's going to be hard. But it bears repeating: These people are posting their often legitimate complaints about a game that they passionately wanted to love. They may not all do it in a civil manner at first, but some of them think they are entering the snake pit and need to bite or get bitten. True, that's their fault, not yours. Let them vent. Coax some sense out of them. Listen first, defend the game second. If you do that, I guarantee this board will be a much happier place and you'll possibly make friends out of people who were determined to make enemies. It's you guys, not the newbies, who control the tone of the board, and this is the most effective way. Sure, the periodic spaz will show up looking to make nothing but trouble. You'll know who they are--not because they criticize--but because they won't engage in conversation after you've listened and tried to understand. Those people you ignore. People like me, you try to forget. If March 19th gives me what I hope it will, you'll soon get your chance. "Don't cry for me, Argentina!" General of the Armies, Yin P.S. I'll still be available for Forum consultations after the 19th, so, Brother Greg, keep my e-mail handy...
Aredhran	posted 03-17-99 06:44 AM ET An Olive Branch... A Fig Leaf... Are you all turning Green or what ? (brainwashed by Deirdre maybe ) -Aredhran
HMFIC	posted 03-17-99 08:41 AM ET Vendetta on whoever nerve stapled yin26!
Bdot	posted 03-17-99 08:54 AM ET but then it's a lot of us oldbies that are the ones complaining.. the ones who were here since the beginning and expected something than what was created. That's the problem with pre-hype and baords like this. It creates an incorrect image of that the game will be. Maybe that's why I liked Civ II so much better. I had no idea there was a game called Civ II til I went to a friends apartment and they were playing it. There was no pre-image of what the game would be.
woodelf	posted 03-17-99 08:58 AM ET "Drone riots have ended" Seriously HMFIC, that made me laugh out loud at work about the stapling. Since I'm one of the newer posters although I've had the game since day 1, I appreciate the help from the "old-timers". I've yet to be truly flamed even though my "Choppers" post was lame for sure. It is hard to sift through archived data especially when some of the best tips come in off-topic posts.
Freddz	posted 03-17-99 09:40 AM ET I guess this is as much a peacekeeper as anything. If I didn't know better, I would think you may have eavesdropped on some of my posts. Amen, sister Yin, peace it is.
December Man	posted 04-20-99 04:46 PM ET . . .another golden moment. . .