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Author Topic:   And the AWARD goes too........
UndertakerAPB posted 02-26-99 11:12 AM ET   Click Here to See the Profile for UndertakerAPB   Click Here to Email UndertakerAPB  
Still early to predict since BIRTH of a FEDERATION and CIVILIZATION: CALL TO POWER hasn't comes out yet.

But to all gamers out there,which game do you think has a chance of winning the STRATEGY GAME of the YEAR AWARD???????


DEVIL'S ADVOCATE,
Undertaker

Lee Johnson posted 02-26-99 11:18 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Lee Johnson  Click Here to Email Lee Johnson     
Considering that we still have five-sixths of the year ahead of us, don't you think that this discussion is a tad premature?
Greg Jones posted 02-26-99 11:24 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Greg Jones  Click Here to Email Greg Jones     
Or does he have so little faith that he wants to get the vote in early?
Brian Pokosh posted 02-26-99 12:18 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Brian Pokosh  Click Here to Email Brian Pokosh     
It's hard to say, but SMAC got a 98% in this month's PC Gamer, their highest score ever. I'd be very surprised if any game beats that this year, let alone a strategy game.

-Brian

Scrubby posted 02-26-99 02:00 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
98%, jeez, I like PCGamer but c'mon?! That should have been Half-Life...
Banquet posted 02-26-99 02:14 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Banquet  Click Here to Email Banquet     
I reckon SMAC deserves 98%!

PCZone gave it 92%, which is too low..

But then again PCZone rated Half life 2% lower than Quake II, so what does that tell you??

It tells me to start buying PCGamer!!

Scrubby posted 02-26-99 02:30 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
Okay, how about this:

100% Half-Life
99% SMAC

Better?

Gergi posted 02-26-99 03:10 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Gergi  Click Here to Email Gergi     
I could have sworn PCGamer gave Civ2 a solid 100% when it came out...Oh well, I think 98% is pretty accurate for SMAC.
Gergi posted 02-26-99 03:14 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Gergi  Click Here to Email Gergi     
Just checked and I was wrong - they gave Civ2 a 97%...
iratheous posted 02-26-99 03:26 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for iratheous  Click Here to Email iratheous     
**OT**
Speaking of half-Life, I think it's funny how sierra is referring to games comming out on the half-life version of the quake ii engine as "Games utilizing Sierra's Half-Life engine".. ohh like they built the friggin thing all by them selves from scratch.. pfft.. :p
Imran Siddiqui posted 02-26-99 03:34 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Imran Siddiqui  Click Here to Email Imran Siddiqui     
SMAC will be the Strategy Game of the Year!

Imran Siddiqui

Scrubby posted 02-26-99 05:48 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
Well Valve did program about 70% of the "Half-Life" engine... wait you just criticized Half-Life, you bastard!!!!
Shining1 posted 02-26-99 05:56 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Shining1  Click Here to Email Shining1     
Yeah, but Total Annihiliation got 97% in a P.C Gamer review. I tend to think they get a little bit carried away when reviewing 3D strategy games.

SMAC will probably get the prize, unless something spectacular comes out later this year. Total Annihilation: Kingdoms is one possibility. Apparently completely different from T.A orginial, and with some nice innovations - experience for units (so you must take CARE of your army), early game rush proof structures, and four distinct sides.

But that's RTS, and doesn't count, right?

Scrubby posted 02-26-99 05:59 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
Total Annihilation received an 85% from PCGamer -- I just checked. More than fair actually.
Borodino posted 02-26-99 10:49 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Borodino  Click Here to Email Borodino     
Plus PC GAmer's seperated TBS and RTS
Imran Siddiqui posted 02-27-99 02:48 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Imran Siddiqui  Click Here to Email Imran Siddiqui     
Oh, something I didn't add: SMAC will get Game of the Year, or second place to Diablo 2! More likely Game of the Year, though, because Civ2 won the prize.

Imran Siddiqui

tOFfGI posted 02-27-99 05:02 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for tOFfGI  Click Here to Email tOFfGI     
Give Sid Meier the Nobel Peace Prize, Whoever wrote the story the litterature prize, and BR the Physics Prize! or not!
Burns posted 02-27-99 08:56 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Burns  Click Here to Email Burns     
I have Half-Life
I have SMAC

Half-life is gathering dust on my harddrive while i play SMAC SMAC SMAC

SMAC for Strategy Game of the Year!

Burns
Yeah, im a little biased :P

geraden posted 02-27-99 12:12 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for geraden  Click Here to Email geraden     
I just wanted to start a bit of a war here. Half Life got a higher rating than what it deserved.

(Waits for incoming planet busters)

Wait, wait! Hear me out...Half life took away about a week of my time when it came out. There were few bugs, it ran great, it looked just awesome, and it scared the hell out of me at times. In the early levels, you found weapons in intelligent places - the shotgun was at the security guard's desk, the pistol was lying next to a dead guy, the revolver was also lying next to a dead guy, ammo was in storage areas, etc, etc...

And then it happened. You get "knocked out" and dragged to the death Star's garbage compactor. Why weren't you killed outright? Is there any reason that you're so special, when they blow away the scientists without a problem? After this, the game goes quickly to hell. Some parts are just awesome still, but as soon as I saw this weird part of the game where I needed to be Mario, jumping over toxic waste and conveyor belts, in order to get to where I needed to go - the amazing suspension of disbelief that had been there immediately evaporated. That's basically what it came down to - the levels were sometimes great, and sometimes plain dumb - the first teleporter level hub was possibly the dumbest series of levels I've ever played.

And I still played it, and had a great time, but it wasn't the same. I'm not saying that Quake or Quake II is better. I'm not saying that there is a better single player FPS out there, though I think that there is. I'm saying that 100% implies a PERFECT game. There would be NOTHING wrong with it. The single player would be the best, multiplayer would be incredible, no bugs, etc. The sheer fact the uninstaller could potentially wipe out your hard drive is enough to give a game a lower rating, but then I'm picky about such things.

Also note that PC gamer isn't exactly the best rating system. In the same issue that they lambasted a game that was "OK, but had too many bugs" they game SiN a 92%. SiN, out of the box, was UNPLAYABLE. This game was atrociously bad. They reviewed and gave that game a high score because they'd look like complete idiots after giving SiN such praise and large articles before (it was on the cover, after all)...

I loved half life. I love Baldur's gate too. Grim Fandango rules. I can't wait to play Thief. None of these games are getting played right now. It's only SMAC. Bastards. Wish games didn't keep getting released during midterms...

Gardener Geraden

QuienSabe posted 02-27-99 05:06 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for QuienSabe  Click Here to Email QuienSabe     
All I can say is this:

Normally I exhibit some self-displine when
it comes to computer gaming (I have a life,
job, girlfriend, these demand time).

Yet with SMAC, I have fought thru the many
bugs in both setup and gameplay, learned some
of the incredible sublteties, I AM STILL
COMING BACK IN EVERY FREE MOMENT.

This game is really good, and I have had
almost as much enjoyment participating in this intelligent and stimulating forum.

Good Job, Firaxis,
QS
PS I wasn't all that impressed by the initial
previews of SMAC.

Arnelos posted 02-27-99 07:06 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Arnelos  Click Here to Email Arnelos     
geraden,

I'm all with you there on midterms...

SMAC hit stores on a Friday here....

My first two philosophy midterms were the following Monday and Tuesday.

I bought SMAC Tuesday night and LAUGHED MY A** OFF at the altered Descartes quote (since I had had fun ripping Descartes' argument in the Third Meditation, the one where he assumes God to exist, to shreads on Monday morning).

I took 3 more mid-terms since then, but have had night of sleep ALL WEEK due to the combination of Political Science and Philosophy mid-terms.

I have a political theory mid-term test on monday and a paper where I have to go diggning around in various Platonic dialogues citing every damn sentence with multiple Sephanus page citations...due Friday.

How much you wanna guess I'm not going to do anything but SMAC until Thursday. Then, on Thursday night, I'll spend the whole night in the library looking up Sephanus pages to cite for my argumentation....

oh well, the joys of being a college student!

Arnelos
Peacekeeper
Keeper of Wisdom

SnowFire posted 02-27-99 08:52 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for SnowFire  Click Here to Email SnowFire     
Yeah, we need to see CTP before we can say TBS game of the year. But if it has a 98% to live up to... I'm thinking that the only game that has a chance of living up to SMAC in the turn-based strategy category is Heroes of Might and Magic III. And if SMAC gets Game of the Year, then HOMM III can get TBS of the year, just as how Civ II got game of the year and HOMM II got TBS of the year 2 years ago.
TheHelperMonkey posted 02-27-99 09:03 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for TheHelperMonkey    
I bought half-life and sadly it didn't work on my GOOD computer with 3dfx, but it did work on my crappy computer, but it was still good. But, there WAS a game killing bug. When you had to get the security guard to follow you and open the door to the huge garage, he just froze. I had to use the "no clip" cheat to go through the door. Other than that, there are still some minor bugs, but it still is a good game. It was also much too easy. I beat it in less than a week. But the ending kicked butt (Ask me if you want to know).
Q Cubed posted 02-27-99 09:21 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Q Cubed  Click Here to Email Q Cubed     
hey...if i recall correctly, i think Undertaker said she was a girl somewhere.

anyway, i like SMAC, i like CTP, and i like ST:BOF. i'm trying to get all three.

why must you fools compare them so?

each one has its own merits, so i fail to see the point.

if i play the demo and like it, i'll get it.
otherwise, i won't.

i hated halflife, but i'm considering getting it so i can see the engine.

same with Quake2 and (cs) Quake3.

undertaker: why do you keep putting these posts up? if you don't like SMAC, why must you complain so much? ah, well.

Chaucer posted 02-27-99 11:43 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Chaucer  Click Here to Email Chaucer     
PC Gamer gave SMAC 98%??? SMAC is a brilliant game yes, but I think the issue here is PC Gamer giving up numbers that are just too inflated. 92% for SIN? Is SMAC only 6% better? I don't bother with PC Gamer or CGW. Give me a PC Accelerator and I'm content - they at least have a good male chauvenist sense of humour, and they seem to present a good balanced review with some quality writing.

Half-Life was/is a great game IMHO, but it was too buggy for many people (it ATE my buddy's Compaq, but then again he's the dumbass who bought one)

Now Thief....that is a truly groundbreaking game - those undead STILL scare me. But even that game has a few problems (but it's not buggy or so I've found) Thief has also taken a gaming backseat (temporarily) to SMAC, which I've been drooling over since, oh, September or so.

Hmmm, I'm ranting. Sorry.
In order to receive 98% from me, a game must satisfy certain criteria. Feel free to debate or suggest my choices.

1) The graphics must be without par for that style of game
-verdict: The units are good - but 98% hmmmm - maybe if the singularity former didn't look just like the base former...repeat Ad Nauseum
The movies are stunning and relate amazingly well to subject technology - Where do you want your Node today!!!
Overall? 85% from me.
2) Sound
Again good, but again the repetition of unit noises.... faction voiceovers are beautiful - especially Yang's "it is every citizens final duty to go into the tanks....."
Lets go with 85% again
3) Originality/research/believability
The storyline for this game is without equal
No game has anything close to the background research and the subsequent integration of story and technology tree. Recommended reading for a computer game?? I love it.
The unit design, while attempted previously in other games, is good enough in SMAC to warrant it an originality award
Documentation is superb (running out of positive adjectives)
A nice fat 98% for this one
4) Playability
This covers bugginess,game speed, ease-of-use, learning curve, menu-quality and the like. SMAC is good to great for most of these - some bugs, most fixed, some still remain. The tutorials - if you need them - are great, learning curve is low via difficulty levels, and the menus are....ahhh...decent. I'd be so happy if I could queue production just by right clicking and not having to use two different buttons for production item/ queue item, and it would be good as well if govenors weren't so gung-ho about 80 turn factories for size three cities - but that can be changed via text files. Multiplayer must have been a major headache to implement - but kudos for trying it.
My %? 95
5) The mystery element
Some games got it....some don't. Civ2 had it, Star Control had it, Wasteland had it *ducking* Ultima IV had it, Diablo had it. It's that something about the game that gets under your skin, it makes you think about it at work, it makes you wonder why you're writing about it when you could be playing it
Does SMAC have it? Yes and no. I can't say it has the raw addiction of Civ2 - like making railroads everywhere just because it looked cool. But multi-player may provide that extra hook. If the game was just a bit faster, well, a lot faster, on my P200mmx
I'd probably give a higher rating....but I really should upgrade I know...or at least go to 64 ram from 32. So I"m withholding judgement on the mystery element for now.

Oh the overall was 85+85+98+95/4
= 94% So I guess it's fairly close - but I wouldn't have given Sin a 92%
Thanks for reading all of this and wasting possible SMAC-time

Wife: Honey...where are you going?
Husband: Just fixing myself a little midnight SMAC dear

Feel free to post your own numbers and flame!

Afterburner posted 02-28-99 12:12 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Afterburner  Click Here to Email Afterburner     
For those of you excited about PC Gamer giving SMAC a 98%, keep in mind that they gave Ascendancy a 92%...

AB

Shining1 posted 02-28-99 12:45 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Shining1  Click Here to Email Shining1     
Ummm... wait a minute here.

I thought PC Gamer didn't do reviews until MONTHS after stuff came out. We are talking about the ink and paper, 27 ads per square inch gaming magazine here aren't we?

Fabio posted 02-28-99 12:51 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Fabio    
Ratings....

Nearly all games magazines overrate the games (more so nowadays), so I generally work on the system (their rating - 50) * 2 = real rating. But anyway...

SMAC rocks. I think that it should be easier and more suited to user modification (the map editor could be improved), the graphics slightly better, the option of simultaneous multiplayer (it couldn't be THAT hard... :-) ) and louder sound (or is that just me), but I still reckon 96 ( (98-50)*2 ) is pretty close.

Hex posted 02-28-99 04:41 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Hex  Click Here to Email Hex     
I bet that this 98% has a 5% "Meier bonus".
I meen he is a genius so it's just we who don't understand the greatness (by the way SMAC is good but not 98... maybe 95)
TheHelperMonkey posted 02-28-99 09:46 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for TheHelperMonkey    
PCG doesn't buy games to rate the, they recieve games from the game producers. SO theif, probably arrived later than they hoped.
UndertakerAPB posted 02-28-99 11:42 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for UndertakerAPB  Click Here to Email UndertakerAPB     
Majority is calling SMAC best-game ever.But most of these people are requesting patches.....

Kind of funny isn't it....


P.S. I agree with you there Hex, a symapthy bonus for Sid would determine the award for this game....

Prerogative posted 02-28-99 12:34 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Prerogative    
There is no single perfect game which doesn't require patches or fixes, Undertaker.
Q Cubed posted 02-28-99 02:48 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Q Cubed  Click Here to Email Q Cubed     
Civ2 has had several patches. Most would agree it was an excellent game, and one of the best for its time.

StarCraft has had several patches. It is now at v1.04.

two great games...both of them regarded by the masses as some of the best. patches are almost always needed because even beta testing will not guarantee that some aspects of the game are flawless.

Seely posted 02-28-99 03:32 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Seely  Click Here to Email Seely     
Again the constant praise of Half-Life. Sure it was well-done, but ultimately wasn't any different than any other FPS. The story was typcial... they should have had something withOUT aliens and dimensional portals. As for the story drawing you in, I don't buy that. I wasn't creeped out or drawn in by anything in Half-Life. You want an immersive environment, play Thief: The Dark Project, which despite being overshadowed by Half-Life's Hype, is the best game I've played since Civ II. SMAC is, of course, a close runner-up, though I think 98% is a bit high, since I found SMAC to be less engaging than Civ II-- I just felt like there was no real sense of what anything looked like on Planet-- no definite sense of what the terrain was like, and no sense at all as to what base structures looked like- I would have liked a little more graphics immersion-- I ended up feeling sort of distant and detached from the empire I was controlling, like I was playing a charts and tables board game... the movies were nice but not enough...
anyway, I'm sure I'll get some responses to this since I dared criticize the shiny new god that is Half-Life, but before you respond, ask yourself if you would have drooled all over Half-Life if it hadn't been so hyped... or if you even would have bought it and instantly loved the story withOUT having read the inundations of articles hyping Half-Life's "immersive story"... something to consider...
Shining1 posted 02-28-99 04:17 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Shining1  Click Here to Email Shining1     
I think it would have been much better if Half-life HADN'T been hyped so much - it would have been a much more surprising game. Like Thief, which doesn't seem to have attracted much hype at all (though I could be wrong).

And what are you comparing Half life to, again? There were no other FPS that even had a real story to them, much less a real and interesting environment. Between the two of them, Half-life and Thief have almost completely rewriten the genre.

As for the game of the year, I would have to pick either Thief (does this count as 1999?), SMAC, T.A Kingdoms (which looks VERY good) or Diablo II. With two of these not yet finished, it's a bit difficult to choose.

SnowFire posted 02-28-99 10:03 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for SnowFire  Click Here to Email SnowFire     
That was a long time ago that the staff that reviewed Ascendenscy was there at PCG. It was that same staff that gave Outpost a good score as well... Their staff nowadays denies everything about what happened then and claims no responsibility. So I don't hold that against them.

I remember that just from looking at the strategy guide on Ascendency, I was like "these races are balanced?!?"

Ender4000 posted 03-01-99 08:22 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Ender4000  Click Here to Email Ender4000     
CGW, a much better source of ratings for games IMO, game SMAC 5 stars. Something they dont' do very often. I've found that most other game magazines just give good ratings to big titles no matter what, CGW is the only one that would give a crappy big name game a poor rating.

Also Half-Life may be a good game, but part of its because of how bad other 3d shooters have been, its what all those other third persons shooters should of been.

Scrubby posted 03-01-99 12:43 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
Jeez you go away for the weekend and the forums go on without you, sheesh!

Anyways, I still think Half-Life is the best game I've ever played, with Starcraft, Diablo, Civ I, and SMAC running a close second. Thief is also really, really good but graphically cannot compare to Half-Life. Multiplayer wise Half-Life edges out Starcraft -- Thief doesnt even have a multiplayer mode (which is not a knock but a fact). In general I find that PCGamer and CGW have honest reviews -- if both rank something highly then I know I'll like the game. If both go sour on a game I usually avoid it (Star Wars Rebellion -- hey I liked it...) and if they differ I usually consult a third source.

Bottomline? I think that Half-Life delivers a better immersive experience from beginning to end. It suffers only from a lag in the latter parts. SMAC delivers a less visceral experience but a more mentally stimulating one. Is it right to compare a TBS to a FPS? Probably not, this is the realm of gut feelings now, but in the end Half-Life wins this gamer's heart. No other game I've ever played has sucked me so deeply into it SMAC included.

Replies appreciated...

Scrubby posted 03-01-99 01:10 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
Oh sorry, a minor point, I was out of gaming for a couple of years (real life keeping me busy) so I was NOT subject to all the Half-Life "hype" -- or anymore so than Sin or whatever.
Catbert posted 03-01-99 06:07 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Catbert    
By the way... does anyone remember the article about SMAC waaaaaay back in PC Gamer?

Febuary 1998, I believe the issue is.

Some interesting changes occured since this article to the shipping version...

Major changes:

Almost every faction featured is different:

1.) Morgans
- Morgan Conglomerate is the full name of the faction
- Morgan looks like a woman to me... (blink)

2.) The University
- Faction used to be "Keepers of Wisdom"
- Lal used to be the leader!

3.) Human Hive
- Used to be called "The Labyrinth"

Secret Projects:

- I'm sure that there has to be some changes. The only movie depicted in the article is the Supercollider (which has undergone change).

Some things that stayed the same:

- System Requirements (!)
- Ascent to Transcendence

Just some interesting stuff.

- Catbert

Brother Greg posted 03-01-99 10:14 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Brother Greg  Click Here to Email Brother Greg     
Actually, I don't know if PCG got it wrong, but the Keepers of Wisdom became the Peacekeepers, so no, Lal didn't change factions.

The Believers were originally called The Conclave. I believe that the UofP had another name, but I can't think of it...

Mostly Harmless posted 03-02-99 06:55 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Mostly Harmless  Click Here to Email Mostly Harmless     
Actualy, the into movie still refers to the Conclave...
Catbert posted 03-02-99 03:33 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Catbert    
Greg - PCG wasn't wrong, I misenterpreted what Keepers of Wisdom turned into.

As Homer Simpson would say... D'oh!

- Catbert

AniSKoV posted 03-03-99 02:07 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for AniSKoV  Click Here to Email AniSKoV     
I think Black and white is going to win the game of the year award, but SMAC will be though contender. And LMK will be the best RPG :-).

hmmm, Three games that will probably have great AI.

Grietz,
AniSKoV

gib01 posted 03-03-99 02:28 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for gib01  Click Here to Email gib01     
Some changes you forgot to mention catbert.

-All of the graphical interfaces were different.

-The units look cooler.

-so does the terrain

-and the unit design interface looks much better than what was in the final version.

-oh yeah, Lady Diedre looks like some blonde bimbo.

MarkG posted 03-03-99 08:54 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for MarkG  Click Here to Email MarkG     
"Majority is calling SMAC best-game ever"
IMHO you cant say that for any game one month after it is released. IMHO the best-game ever should be playable after 2 years(or anyway at least one year after), just like civ2.

I still get mails or see posts on our forums saying "I got civ2 two days ago and I have a question..."

However, SMAC could very easily be "game of the year" or "tbs of the year"

Markos, Apolyton Civilization Site
civilization.gamestats.com

UndertakerAPB posted 03-03-99 10:00 AM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for UndertakerAPB  Click Here to Email UndertakerAPB     
I am honored to attract your attention --MarkG...
Scrubby posted 03-03-99 03:17 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for Scrubby  Click Here to Email Scrubby     
Undertaker, how do you do it? Your threads are always soo damn long! They never friggin' die!

ps. I love SMAC but if it is a 98% then the PCGamer staff are a bunch of crackheads.

SnowFire posted 03-03-99 05:39 PM ET     Click Here to See the Profile for SnowFire  Click Here to Email SnowFire     
Sheesh. Changes sinec the old PCG article:

Energy was decided based on heat rather than altitude. Each square was rated on temperature, hot, temperate, or cold. Hot squares generated more energy.

The UoP were the Archons and had really bad base names like "The one and Prime" and "Tetrogram Nexus." The Gaians' bases were all "Garden of ____." The Labyrinth also concentrated on science, something they don't do anymore.

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