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Author Topic:   Does the computer help you out?

chief20 posted 02-18-99 01:04 PM ET
Several times I have attacked factions at war with other people that i was allied with. But when Im in trouble, the computer factions Im with never seem to help out, even if their units are close to a mutual enemy. Am I asking too much from computer AI nowadays or will this game do this?
Scrubby posted 02-18-99 01:17 PM ET
I seem to have this problem too. My allies are all too quick to ask for my help for FREE and when I PAY them to help me they sign a blood truce of treaty in the next turn -- argh! 800 credits down the drain. The only time I actually got "allies" to work was when I used a probe team on Morgan and blamed it successfully on UoP... hehe, they were still fighting a hundred years later...
Still, the computer factions seem remarkably touchy and pushy.
clockhammer posted 02-18-99 01:23 PM ET
When at war I've actually had the computer help me out some. During my last game, I was easily dominating the rest of the factions playing as Morgan and had a pretty solid Pact relationship built up with Yang. The only factions left (other than the two of us) were the Believers and the Spartans (who we were warring with). My fight with the Believers and Spartans was really Yang's war, but my alliance with him got me into it. The whole time I fought Miriam, Yang just flew his jets around Planet dropping them in and out of my various bases (for "refueling" purposes). It wasn't until I gave Yang one of his best cities back to him (an location in the middle of a landmark of 8 monoliths, known as "the Ruins") that he started sending me needlejets to fight the few Believer cities left and the Spartans.
I guess my point is that Ambivelent to Hostile allies may not fight alongside you, but if you can get their attitude to change to Solicitous or better that they will start fighting with you and giving you units for base fortification.
The designers or beta testers would have a better underlying knowledge as to what causes an ally to fight your common enemies or give you free goodies.
Titan posted 02-18-99 01:38 PM ET
In the demo, my allies always gac=ve me free unit, and they did what we had agreed on when we coordinated battle plans.
In the game, I'm still in my first game, but my allies still gives me free units when I am at war. I am the PK, and my allie is the Hive.
Rong posted 02-18-99 01:50 PM ET
The worst is when I fought a hard and long battle, picked off all the defending units in a city, and in come my Pact sister, and the city is hers.
I really hate that.
CEO Bernard posted 02-18-99 02:11 PM ET
I had the Peacekeepers help me out once. It was a truly glorious sight. The little Purple flags and Yellow flags standing side by side. UoP never knew what hit them. It was truly a major moment for me in computer gaming.
On the other hand, I have had rotten backstabbing factions do what you are talking about!! Argh! (see thread Lets talk about greedy). The computer definitely seems to have unrealistic demands and is extremely touchy about them. I think perhaps excessively so, but I concede that there could be a balance issue at stake ... maybe.
CEO Bernard
"Orderly exchange of energy states ... to heck with energy states, just give me your money and I'll give you an over-priced usless product you don't really need or want."
kjchen posted 02-18-99 02:24 PM ET
I'm currently playing a game as the Gaians, Talent level. Early in the game I noticed that The Hive was dominating the greater part of the continent that I was on, so when he came in demanding technology, I gave it to him. A few turns later, I decided to trade a few more technologies with him, and to my surprise, he offered me a Pact. Figuring this would keep him off my back until I could secure my borders, I agreed. Some time thereafter he called for my aid against the University, so (with a sense of impending doom) I agreed and sent all the mindworms I'd managed to capture to help out.
As it turns out, this was the right move.
Once the map was revealed, it turns out that Yang had eliminated a good deal of the University (including University Base), and Zakharov was holding onto a couple of cities. I pounded on his plasma sentinels with my armor-ignoring (pre-boil -- yikes!) mindworms, and captured one of his cities. I immediately talked to Zakharov and browbeat him into submission (getting a slew of nifty technologies in the process), at which point I turned around, talked to Yang, and persuaded him to leave my new "friend" alone. To my great joy, Yang complied. I repeated this process later with the Spartans. During my capture of one of the Spartan bases, I was down to a badly-damaged Impact Rover and a nearly-as-dead Mindworm Boil. The turn after I took the base, Yang prompty marched in several Laser Squads to sit around to act as defensive fodder.
After rejecting several ridiculous demands from both Miriam and Morgan, both factions separately declared Vendetta on me. In one case, Yang followed with a declaration of Vendetta against the new aggressor; in the other case, I had to ask him politely (but he said yes anyway ). I'm currently in the process of laying siege to Morgan's cities (which are on an island), and while I bombard the cities and attempt to land Trained Gatling Squads nearby, Yang has been providing Needlejet air cover and bombing runs.
One thing that I have noticed is that you need to check the outlook of your allies on a regular basis. At one point, Yang was Seething, so I gave him a couple of techs to get him back up to Magnanimous again. Also, he seems to downgrade his attitude much less often now that I've become a Police State.
I have to say, to date I'm quite impressed with the diplomacy engine in the game. I haven't played on any of the aggressive difficulty levels yet, though, so perhaps the computers are just being nice to me.
Brian and company: care to share any other factors which could affect the efficiency of the computer in rendering aid to a Pact-allied player?
Dredd posted 02-18-99 04:11 PM ET
I've been loving the diplomacy! My game is to the point where I (Gaians) am allied with the Hive and the University. The PKs and Spartans are allied against us, and losing badly, of course. I thought it was interesting how factions that are usually complete opposites were able to ally eventually when my coalition became too strong for them.
I do have to keep feeding Yang tech, as I am a democracy. But he's been giving me units galore! What fun.
ThRiLL posted 02-18-99 04:14 PM ET
no.. I think you're bang on. I've had pact brothers who think very highly of me do all sorts of things that you describe... fill my bases with extra defenses.. attack my foes.. . and sometimes just plain give me units.
The game I am currently playing actually has me as the UoP. Early on, I kicked both Miriam and the PK's so hard they cried, and both surrendered to me. The rest of the game, every time they build outside of what I consider "their allowed space" I demand that they cede the new city to me or else I'll break the blood pact. =)
With them subdued like this, they have also been my cannon fodder through my whole war with Morgan, (the secondmost dominant force - behind me of course)
It's perfect. I organize a small strike of vastly superior tech (I am WAY ahead, and I have Hunter/seeker, so they cant probe me. ) and take a city. my cannon fodder then floods the area with their cheap defenders and whimpy attack forces. Then if Morgan counter attacks with needlejets or such, half the time he is attacking the cannon fodder.
I love it. =)
-ThRiLL
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Author	Topic: Does the computer help you out?
chief20	posted 02-18-99 01:04 PM ET Several times I have attacked factions at war with other people that i was allied with. But when Im in trouble, the computer factions Im with never seem to help out, even if their units are close to a mutual enemy. Am I asking too much from computer AI nowadays or will this game do this?
Scrubby	posted 02-18-99 01:17 PM ET I seem to have this problem too. My allies are all too quick to ask for my help for FREE and when I PAY them to help me they sign a blood truce of treaty in the next turn -- argh! 800 credits down the drain. The only time I actually got "allies" to work was when I used a probe team on Morgan and blamed it successfully on UoP... hehe, they were still fighting a hundred years later... Still, the computer factions seem remarkably touchy and pushy.
clockhammer	posted 02-18-99 01:23 PM ET When at war I've actually had the computer help me out some. During my last game, I was easily dominating the rest of the factions playing as Morgan and had a pretty solid Pact relationship built up with Yang. The only factions left (other than the two of us) were the Believers and the Spartans (who we were warring with). My fight with the Believers and Spartans was really Yang's war, but my alliance with him got me into it. The whole time I fought Miriam, Yang just flew his jets around Planet dropping them in and out of my various bases (for "refueling" purposes). It wasn't until I gave Yang one of his best cities back to him (an location in the middle of a landmark of 8 monoliths, known as "the Ruins") that he started sending me needlejets to fight the few Believer cities left and the Spartans. I guess my point is that Ambivelent to Hostile allies may not fight alongside you, but if you can get their attitude to change to Solicitous or better that they will start fighting with you and giving you units for base fortification. The designers or beta testers would have a better underlying knowledge as to what causes an ally to fight your common enemies or give you free goodies.
Titan	posted 02-18-99 01:38 PM ET In the demo, my allies always gac=ve me free unit, and they did what we had agreed on when we coordinated battle plans. In the game, I'm still in my first game, but my allies still gives me free units when I am at war. I am the PK, and my allie is the Hive.
Rong	posted 02-18-99 01:50 PM ET The worst is when I fought a hard and long battle, picked off all the defending units in a city, and in come my Pact sister, and the city is hers. I really hate that.
CEO Bernard	posted 02-18-99 02:11 PM ET I had the Peacekeepers help me out once. It was a truly glorious sight. The little Purple flags and Yellow flags standing side by side. UoP never knew what hit them. It was truly a major moment for me in computer gaming. On the other hand, I have had rotten backstabbing factions do what you are talking about!! Argh! (see thread Lets talk about greedy). The computer definitely seems to have unrealistic demands and is extremely touchy about them. I think perhaps excessively so, but I concede that there could be a balance issue at stake ... maybe. CEO Bernard "Orderly exchange of energy states ... to heck with energy states, just give me your money and I'll give you an over-priced usless product you don't really need or want."
kjchen	posted 02-18-99 02:24 PM ET I'm currently playing a game as the Gaians, Talent level. Early in the game I noticed that The Hive was dominating the greater part of the continent that I was on, so when he came in demanding technology, I gave it to him. A few turns later, I decided to trade a few more technologies with him, and to my surprise, he offered me a Pact. Figuring this would keep him off my back until I could secure my borders, I agreed. Some time thereafter he called for my aid against the University, so (with a sense of impending doom) I agreed and sent all the mindworms I'd managed to capture to help out. As it turns out, this was the right move. Once the map was revealed, it turns out that Yang had eliminated a good deal of the University (including University Base), and Zakharov was holding onto a couple of cities. I pounded on his plasma sentinels with my armor-ignoring (pre-boil -- yikes!) mindworms, and captured one of his cities. I immediately talked to Zakharov and browbeat him into submission (getting a slew of nifty technologies in the process), at which point I turned around, talked to Yang, and persuaded him to leave my new "friend" alone. To my great joy, Yang complied. I repeated this process later with the Spartans. During my capture of one of the Spartan bases, I was down to a badly-damaged Impact Rover and a nearly-as-dead Mindworm Boil. The turn after I took the base, Yang prompty marched in several Laser Squads to sit around to act as defensive fodder. After rejecting several ridiculous demands from both Miriam and Morgan, both factions separately declared Vendetta on me. In one case, Yang followed with a declaration of Vendetta against the new aggressor; in the other case, I had to ask him politely (but he said yes anyway ). I'm currently in the process of laying siege to Morgan's cities (which are on an island), and while I bombard the cities and attempt to land Trained Gatling Squads nearby, Yang has been providing Needlejet air cover and bombing runs. One thing that I have noticed is that you need to check the outlook of your allies on a regular basis. At one point, Yang was Seething, so I gave him a couple of techs to get him back up to Magnanimous again. Also, he seems to downgrade his attitude much less often now that I've become a Police State. I have to say, to date I'm quite impressed with the diplomacy engine in the game. I haven't played on any of the aggressive difficulty levels yet, though, so perhaps the computers are just being nice to me. Brian and company: care to share any other factors which could affect the efficiency of the computer in rendering aid to a Pact-allied player?
Dredd	posted 02-18-99 04:11 PM ET I've been loving the diplomacy! My game is to the point where I (Gaians) am allied with the Hive and the University. The PKs and Spartans are allied against us, and losing badly, of course. I thought it was interesting how factions that are usually complete opposites were able to ally eventually when my coalition became too strong for them. I do have to keep feeding Yang tech, as I am a democracy. But he's been giving me units galore! What fun.
ThRiLL	posted 02-18-99 04:14 PM ET no.. I think you're bang on. I've had pact brothers who think very highly of me do all sorts of things that you describe... fill my bases with extra defenses.. attack my foes.. . and sometimes just plain give me units. The game I am currently playing actually has me as the UoP. Early on, I kicked both Miriam and the PK's so hard they cried, and both surrendered to me. The rest of the game, every time they build outside of what I consider "their allowed space" I demand that they cede the new city to me or else I'll break the blood pact. =) With them subdued like this, they have also been my cannon fodder through my whole war with Morgan, (the secondmost dominant force - behind me of course) It's perfect. I organize a small strike of vastly superior tech (I am WAY ahead, and I have Hunter/seeker, so they cant probe me. ) and take a city. my cannon fodder then floods the area with their cheap defenders and whimpy attack forces. Then if Morgan counter attacks with needlejets or such, half the time he is attacking the cannon fodder. I love it. =) -ThRiLL