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Author Topic:   Forests seem better then Mines

Rafael posted 02-14-99 01:01 PM ET
another thing about this terraforming ability i found is it seems that forests not only provide the same amount of minerals as a mine but they also provide more energy and food. It seems cost and time prohibative to go with anything other then a forest early on ( not counting thermal boreholes of coarse). If this is true why did the prrogramers add this useless land upgrade ?
Grosshaus posted 02-14-99 01:56 PM ET
Mines and others get better after a while. So if you plant huge forests, which also expand on their own, you must later on spend lots of time cutting them down.
futRtrubL posted 02-14-99 03:06 PM ET
it depends where you put the mines. on flat land they are really useless, put up boreholes instead. also you need a certain tech in order to go over the 2mineral limit.
Lee Johnson posted 02-15-99 10:32 AM ET
"put up boreholes instead"
Yes. Once you've got the tech for boreholes, it's party time! However, a good mine is a valuable resource in the early game, especially if you're lucky enough to get one sitting on a mineral deposit.
bene4 posted 02-15-99 02:41 PM ET
Sometimes I get a message "Forest harvested near base. 5 minerals given to base".
This is cool - early in the game use forests, then clearcut them and stripmine. Use boreholes if you want to get swarmed with boils, or mines if you don't.
Audrey Two posted 02-15-99 02:57 PM ET
Yup. If you build an improvement on a forest (other than forest-compatible ones like sensor arrays), you get a five-mineral bonus for cutting down the trees.
If you ever have a former with nothing better to do, send it off to plant forest somewhere you aren't using yet. Those trees can't possibly do you any harm.
--A2
Xentropy posted 02-15-99 09:49 PM ET
what on earth? I found things to be *totally* the opposite... early on farms and mines and such are good, but later, once you get tree farms, and especially hybrid forests, all you should *bother* with are forests cuz then you get 3/2/2 out of forests, which is better than you can ever manage out of even a rainy and rolling square with a farm, solar, adjacent ecschelon mirror, etc etc etc etc... boreholes and forests are all that's worth it after hybrid forests become available...
PersonaNonGrata posted 02-15-99 11:45 PM ET
Yes, forests with tree farm and hybrid forest enhancement are great, but consider how long before anyone gets those two techs and actually have time to build those two facilities. If you got fungi enhancement techs, wow.. the enhancements are even better! I think the forest thingy is to allow you to start off new bases quickly without spending lots of turns.
Perhaps you can make mines and solar collectors early in the game, and then start tearing them down for forests when you get hybrid forests. Another good thing about forests is that computer AI don't usually go about tearing up your forests.
Xentropy posted 02-16-99 12:05 AM ET
exactly... that's what i do, PNG... just most of the people on this thread were talking about *starting* with forests then *later* replacing them with mines and solar collectors... that makes no sense to me, since I do the exact opposite of what they do :>
futRtrubL posted 02-16-99 09:34 PM ET
I start with forests, unless there are nutrient, energy or mineral bonuses, then migrate to boreholes on flat land, once all fungi tech done start reseading fungi, by then i have the defences in place to stop superboils.
MxM posted 02-16-99 10:46 PM ET
mine+road+rocky=4 minerals, minimal (or no?) ecodamage
grunthex posted 02-17-99 02:13 PM ET
My take on forests is a bit oddish. I always put forests on flat squares, and solar/farm the rolling squares (rocky squares I terraform down to rolling). I don't do many other improvements, other than the occasional condensor to help moisture. But since I'm a nice-to-planet guy (and I hate blooms destroying my improvements), I'm willing to keep my production low, so in the mid-end game, when I normally get eco-damage, I'll tear the forests down for farm/solars, and count on the rolling squares plus the factory type buildings for my production. Get more population that way too.
Andrew Kasantsev posted 02-17-99 05:43 PM ET
I always use forest, forest and almost nothing but forests. In the beginning, in the middle, and often in the end of the game (then fungus is better).
Condition: I try to build first cities ONLY on some resources places (monolite, mineral, nutrient). And raise forests OVER them!
Exception - boreholes, rocky+mineral (mine there), in the beginning - 1-2 farm on places where you can get 3 food. Better use water for kelp farm.
For necessary nutrient use suppliers! They dont need population to retract nutrient, so built 1-2 on city and move them in good place.
Now I had problem with OVERpopulation, and that is even not middlegame - still get only chaos plasma penetrator as best weapon (I'm UoP) and most of my cities is 7-14 size...
Kedryn posted 02-18-99 04:43 AM ET
In the early game, I love to plant forests on nutrient resources, unless it's rainy/rolling. 3/2/1 that early in the game is really nice.
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Author	Topic: Forests seem better then Mines
Rafael	posted 02-14-99 01:01 PM ET another thing about this terraforming ability i found is it seems that forests not only provide the same amount of minerals as a mine but they also provide more energy and food. It seems cost and time prohibative to go with anything other then a forest early on ( not counting thermal boreholes of coarse). If this is true why did the prrogramers add this useless land upgrade ?
Grosshaus	posted 02-14-99 01:56 PM ET Mines and others get better after a while. So if you plant huge forests, which also expand on their own, you must later on spend lots of time cutting them down.
futRtrubL	posted 02-14-99 03:06 PM ET it depends where you put the mines. on flat land they are really useless, put up boreholes instead. also you need a certain tech in order to go over the 2mineral limit.
Lee Johnson	posted 02-15-99 10:32 AM ET "put up boreholes instead" Yes. Once you've got the tech for boreholes, it's party time! However, a good mine is a valuable resource in the early game, especially if you're lucky enough to get one sitting on a mineral deposit.
bene4	posted 02-15-99 02:41 PM ET Sometimes I get a message "Forest harvested near base. 5 minerals given to base". This is cool - early in the game use forests, then clearcut them and stripmine. Use boreholes if you want to get swarmed with boils, or mines if you don't.
Audrey Two	posted 02-15-99 02:57 PM ET Yup. If you build an improvement on a forest (other than forest-compatible ones like sensor arrays), you get a five-mineral bonus for cutting down the trees. If you ever have a former with nothing better to do, send it off to plant forest somewhere you aren't using yet. Those trees can't possibly do you any harm. --A2
Xentropy	posted 02-15-99 09:49 PM ET what on earth? I found things to be totally the opposite... early on farms and mines and such are good, but later, once you get tree farms, and especially hybrid forests, all you should bother with are forests cuz then you get 3/2/2 out of forests, which is better than you can ever manage out of even a rainy and rolling square with a farm, solar, adjacent ecschelon mirror, etc etc etc etc... boreholes and forests are all that's worth it after hybrid forests become available...
PersonaNonGrata	posted 02-15-99 11:45 PM ET Yes, forests with tree farm and hybrid forest enhancement are great, but consider how long before anyone gets those two techs and actually have time to build those two facilities. If you got fungi enhancement techs, wow.. the enhancements are even better! I think the forest thingy is to allow you to start off new bases quickly without spending lots of turns. Perhaps you can make mines and solar collectors early in the game, and then start tearing them down for forests when you get hybrid forests. Another good thing about forests is that computer AI don't usually go about tearing up your forests.
Xentropy	posted 02-16-99 12:05 AM ET exactly... that's what i do, PNG... just most of the people on this thread were talking about starting with forests then later replacing them with mines and solar collectors... that makes no sense to me, since I do the exact opposite of what they do :>
futRtrubL	posted 02-16-99 09:34 PM ET I start with forests, unless there are nutrient, energy or mineral bonuses, then migrate to boreholes on flat land, once all fungi tech done start reseading fungi, by then i have the defences in place to stop superboils.
MxM	posted 02-16-99 10:46 PM ET mine+road+rocky=4 minerals, minimal (or no?) ecodamage
grunthex	posted 02-17-99 02:13 PM ET My take on forests is a bit oddish. I always put forests on flat squares, and solar/farm the rolling squares (rocky squares I terraform down to rolling). I don't do many other improvements, other than the occasional condensor to help moisture. But since I'm a nice-to-planet guy (and I hate blooms destroying my improvements), I'm willing to keep my production low, so in the mid-end game, when I normally get eco-damage, I'll tear the forests down for farm/solars, and count on the rolling squares plus the factory type buildings for my production. Get more population that way too.
Andrew Kasantsev	posted 02-17-99 05:43 PM ET I always use forest, forest and almost nothing but forests. In the beginning, in the middle, and often in the end of the game (then fungus is better). Condition: I try to build first cities ONLY on some resources places (monolite, mineral, nutrient). And raise forests OVER them! Exception - boreholes, rocky+mineral (mine there), in the beginning - 1-2 farm on places where you can get 3 food. Better use water for kelp farm. For necessary nutrient use suppliers! They dont need population to retract nutrient, so built 1-2 on city and move them in good place. Now I had problem with OVERpopulation, and that is even not middlegame - still get only chaos plasma penetrator as best weapon (I'm UoP) and most of my cities is 7-14 size...
Kedryn	posted 02-18-99 04:43 AM ET In the early game, I love to plant forests on nutrient resources, unless it's rainy/rolling. 3/2/1 that early in the game is really nice.